Questions about shimless buckets

[2slow2jz]

ive done search for info on this but cant seem to come up with much info? im not very informed about these, but from what i understand, their use is neccesitated/beneficial when revving your engine higher and they also drop weight from the valvetrain? can someone with info and experience with this setup chime in and give me the 411 also, where would you find these for a 2JZGTE head, and would they need machining to fit?

TIA

[Ishii]

Simple,

Measure the valve clearance, then remove all buckets keeping them numbered as to where they go, use a micrometer and measure their thichness, calculate desired clearance, go to Toyota and order valve buckets for a MR-2 spyder they are availabel in .02mm incriments, fit perfectly no machining required cost about 300$ for all 24. I did it to mine and seems to rev a little smoother at higher rpm.

Ishii
(toyota master tech)

[Ishii]

Also it removes 12 ounces or more from the valvetrain depending on how thick the original shims were.

[2slow2jz]

thanks Ishii

[Ishii]

Here is a pic of how to measure your buckets.

and a table that shows bucket number per thickness.
the number is printed inside the bucket, so when you get them just look at the number and refer to the chart to see what size it is.

Ishii

[jeremyb]

ok wait so what exactly is the purpose of this? You get the mr2 buckets that are thicker so you don't use the shims on the stock buckets? uhm what exactly are the buckets? i see in the pic wut thye look like but i mean. is there another word fo it other than buckets?

[ssrmr2turbo]

what is the od of the OEM supra buckets and shims?? can anyone please list the specs

thanks

[makaveli200369]

I dont understand how does it weigh less when it ends up being the same thickness as the stock buckets along with the shims to get the same clearance? Are the shims made of heavier material?

[Rsupra]

this is a common mod done to the 91-95 mr2 turbo as well, it basically reduces weight and prevents a undersize shim to fly out at high rpm's is more for safety I would say.

[Ishii]

I dont understand how does it weigh less when it ends up being the same thickness as the stock buckets along with the shims to get the same clearance? Are the shims made of heavier material?

Here is the difference. The shimless buckets outside surface is much thinner compared to a Shim. The Shimless bucket on the inside has a center tip (refer to picture above) that veries in length making up the total thickness.
Where as a Shim has the same thickness for the entire diameter of the bucket.

So less material=less wieght.

This is mostly helpfull for High lift camshafts so the shims don't get shot out. (not really a problem on the 2jz or 3s) but on a 7m or 4a they are absolutely needed with high lift camshafts.

But for people looking for every single performance upgrade possible even to get that 10th of a horsepower, reducing valve train weight will help.

Ishii

[makaveli200369]

Oh I get it now. With your explanation and the pic I see what your saying now. Thanks

[gLok]

This also works on the 1mz-fe v6.

[Smaay]

I have done this mod on my All-Trac 3S-GTE...just like ishii described the installation is how i did it

[TwinTurbo_SixSpeed]

I plan on doing this, am I supposed to measure with the shim still in the bucket? Most of my shims alone were 2.7 - 2.9mm, the minimum shimless bucket thickness in the above attachment from Ishii is 5.06... I'm guessing I need the thickness of the stock bucket added to my shim thicknesses to get the right shimless bucket sizes I need to order?

[Ishii]

I plan on doing this, am I supposed to measure with the shim still in the bucket?

Yes. you should have not removed them. Sorry for not making that clear.
You must measure the old bucket with the shim still in it. Do not remove the shims off the buckets before measuring it may cause you to be off by a .001" to .002" if the shim isn't sitting perfectly on the bucket.

Place the shim back in the bucket and make sure to push it down hard and ensure that the shim is seated.

If you have mismatched the shims and buckets you need to retake your valve clearance and start over. (meaning you don't know if you put the same shim back on the same bucket)

Adding the shim thickness to the bucket thickness should work, but will most likely give you a slightly inacurate reading. It is better to take one measurement.

Ishii

[kowalski]

Ishii, check you pm. Box is full.

Can someone post Toyota part numbers for these buckets ?
My local dealer here in germany knows nothing about them because we don't have these cars on our roads, so some part # would be fine !

Thank you all !

[jt2ma71]

Hi Steve, I am thinking of doing this. I have a set of HKS 272's and have re-shimmed all 24 to get the clearances to spec. The motor is not done but I am really thinking of going with shimless buckets now. Is there a danger of spitting out the conventional shims when revving up to 9K with 272's? Thanks!

[Ishii]

Hi Steve, I am thinking of doing this. I have a set of HKS 272's and have re-shimmed all 24 to get the clearances to spec. The motor is not done but I am really thinking of going with shimless buckets now. Is there a danger of spitting out the conventional shims when revving up to 9K with 272's? Thanks!

hahaha, with the amount of time and money in your motor? Whats 2-3 hours and
300$?!!!!

to be honest I can't give a 100% answer to your question. But I think you will be ok. But at 9krpm I'd be more interested in the weight savings to shut the valves. Can't wait to see your project when it's done!

Ishii

[kowalski]

Ishii,

once again: any part numbers available ?

Thanks !

[Syed Shah]

Bump for part numbers! Thanks!

[Magic]

Here are the part numbers and sizes for the shimless buckets:

13751-46030 5.06 mm

13751-46040 5.08

13751-46050 5.10

13751-46060 5.12

13751-46070 5.14

13751-46080 5.16

13751-46090 5.18

13751-46100 5.20

13751-46110 5.22

13751-46120 5.24

13751-46130 5.26

13751-46140 5.28

13751-46150 5.30

13751-46160 5.32

13751-46170 5.34

13751-46180 5.36

13751-46190 5.38

13751-46200 5.40

13751-46210 5.42

13751-46220 5.44

13751-46230 5.46

13751-46240 5.48

13751-46250 5.50

13751-46260 5.52

13751-46270 5.54

13751-46280 5.56

13751-46290 5.58

13751-46300 5.60

13751-46310 5.62

13751-46320 5.64

13751-46330 5.66

13751-46340 5.68

13751-46350 5.70

13751-46360 5.72

13751-46370 5.74

[Syed Shah]

Thanks!

[navyguy0023]

Great info here!! Doing this right now!

[Syed Shah]

Done

[SupraPolak]

Here's a quick and probably simple question with a probably even more obvious answer, but...

When you are doing the valve clearance measurements and the clearance is out or you just want to modify the valve clearance for whatever reason (tighter/looser etc.)

You would simply measure the bucket and shim, as per the description above (i.e. with the shim still on the bucket), and then add, or subtract, the appropriate valve clearance measurement.

Say one of the valve clearance was below spec, .08mm instead of the minimum .15mm. I would then measure the shim and bucket and add .07mm to that measurement (shim+bucket) to give me a total shimless bucket of the appropriate thickness, correct?

On a similar note, can someone please comment on the validity of the following quote, in particular, whether a loose clearance is better than a tight one.

A loose valve is a happy valve, as opposed to a tight valve that will do damage. They do get tighter, as opposed to loose. The correct clearances are:

Intake: 0.15 - 0.25 mm / 0.006 - 0.010 in
Exh: 0.25 - 0.35 mm / 0.010 - 0.014 in

Intake side can be tight, but not the exhaust side.

Sorry for the thread revival