Changing Valve Springs and Retainers without removing head?

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Thread: Changing Valve Springs and Retainers without removing head?

  1. #1
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    Changing Valve Springs and Retainers without removing head?

    I was wondering if its possible to change valve springs and retainers without removing the head and having the valves fall down.

    I've seen someone do it but Im not sure what are the steps on doing this.

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  3. #2
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    same process as valve stem seal replacement!
    http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0geu7_YOc...tem/index.html

  4. #3
    Tell me bout the whistles Vu's Avatar
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    Just take out you sparkplugs and stuff a 5/16'' rope into the cylinder and turn the crank. The piston will compress the rope and hold the valves in place.

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    SupraForums Member 1BIG1's Avatar
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    I think it's the same process as when you do the valve steam seals. The Rope trick!

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    Speed limits = Guidelines suprant0010's Avatar
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    just the thought of removing and reinstalling 24 valve springs while leaning over a fender makes my back hurt
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    Sweet!

    Thanks guys. Putting those damn valve locks on upgrade springs is what I think would suck the most. I have the motor out but didnt want to pull the head to install the springs and retainers.

  8. #7
    Is it turbo? Is it stick? TROLL's Avatar
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    I'm getting ready to do this with the motor in the car... not really looking forward to it.
    You can also use compressed air in the cylinders to keep the valves from dropping, in fact my machinist recommended this vs. rope since its guaranteed to put even pressure on the valves and not damage them in any way.
    I should have done this when I had the motor stripped down to a bare longblock last year! Could have just pulled the head and checked out what things looked like inside. Oh well... you know what they say about hindsight...

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    im doing mine thurs via rope trick.....if u want to do air way i would just make sure that electric is good and machine is very good u dont want a trip or to loose pressure in compressor

  10. #9
    Is it turbo? Is it stick? TROLL's Avatar
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    I've read on here about someone who intentionally let go of a valve stem when he was working on his to grab a dropped keeper, and with his piston at TDC the valve didnt drop all the way in, the valve was sitting on the piston and the stem was still sticking through and he just pulled it up. Do I want to test this intentionally? Not really... but that gave me a little bit of confidence with this route. Any compressor with an automatic pressure regulator on it should be fine though.

  11. #10
    What about the toe? Patrick94TT's Avatar
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    I had the worst experience doing springs and retainers on my Supra with the head still in. Maybe it was because I didn't have the right spring compressor, but the Crower springs I installed were stiff as shit and I ended up pulling the head in order to get them in. I did my valve seals using the rope trick and it worked great though.

  12. #11
    Is it turbo? Is it stick? TROLL's Avatar
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    What valve spring compressor were you using? I don't have one yet but am planning to use the one that bolts to the head and uses leverage to compress them... from what I'm told thats the only reasonable way to install aftermarket stiffer springs.

  13. #12
    What about the toe? Patrick94TT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TROLL View Post
    What valve spring compressor were you using? I don't have one yet but am planning to use the one that bolts to the head and uses leverage to compress them... from what I'm told thats the only reasonable way to install aftermarket stiffer springs.
    That's the one I used, but you can't position the spring compressor on the head in the right position unless you pull the head. Or maybe I just suck and wasted three months of my time for nothing?
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  14. #13
    DFA Motorsports DinnerTime's Avatar
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    With the head off the car I can get the springs off in 10-15 seconds; its getting the new springs installed that takes the most time. I use a compression tester adapter to fill the cylinder with compressed air, it has a valve on it so I don't even have to leave it hooked to the compressor since it only takes a few mins.

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    ?!!?HABBA BABBA??!! 93civEJ1's Avatar
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    you were right about it going to be a pain in the ass with upgraded springs / retainers as far as getting the keepers back on....def get a toyotool and make a T handle for that extra pressure needed to compress the springs for the keeper to fall in....ask me how i know!

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    Proud MKIII Owner 871JZ's Avatar
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    very interesting, i've always known of using compressed air, but the rope trick is a first for me.
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    Luvs ( . ) ( . )s StickyRice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 93civEJ1 View Post
    you were right about it going to be a pain in the ass with upgraded springs / retainers as far as getting the keepers back on....def get a toyotool and make a T handle for that extra pressure needed to compress the springs for the keeper to fall in....ask me how i know!
    Been there done that man, installing upgraded springs is the biggest PITA ever. I was pretty much standing on top of the engine using my body weight to get the locks on.

  18. #17
    Is it turbo? Is it stick? TROLL's Avatar
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    with what spring compressor though? that is the question...

    if anyone has done this successfully and had a half decent experience with it, please list all of the essentials! specific tools used, tips, tricks, things to expect, etc.

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    Luvs ( . ) ( . )s StickyRice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TROLL View Post
    with what spring compressor though? that is the question...

    if anyone has done this successfully and had a half decent experience with it, please list all of the essentials! specific tools used, tips, tricks, things to expect, etc.
    Toyo tool with a crafts man jack handle slipped over it, and use a lot of elbow grease. It actually went pretty quick my dad helped, and we did the first cyclinder first day to see what its about and 2nd day did 3 more and last day did the remainging two. Number six is not as bad as you think remove the engine hook and get good leverage and let it rock, only trick I can say is to give it one quick hard shove, going slow don't help much and usually only locks one of the keepers so you have to pop it out and try it again.

  20. #19
    Speed limits = Guidelines suprant0010's Avatar
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    it requires the head to be removed and placed on a bench, but i built a universal valve spring compressor

    it works alot like a giant gear puller, i made it big so it could work on any head i happen to come accross...i havent tryed it on aftermarket springs yet, but i think it would do it with ease

  21. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by TROLL View Post
    with what spring compressor though? that is the question...

    if anyone has done this successfully and had a half decent experience with it, please list all of the essentials! specific tools used, tips, tricks, things to expect, etc.

    I liked that guys idea of using the fitting that came with his compression test kit. 2 tools in 1, check your compression and fill your cylinders with air.

  22. #21
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    No ropes

    I just wanted to chime in a few thoughts here. I usually use the air method but that is not foolproof the keepers are usually stuck and take a little tap when the cpmpressor is pushing down to get them to release, this will usually push the valve in and release the air so just be a little careful.

    I did have 1 horrible experience with the rope trick years and years ago on a taurus SHO. Because the valve moved when releaseing the keepers the rope slipped around the valve itself and was stuck. Several hours later we finally jiggled it out but we were all but sure the head was going to come off to get it out. Not fun at all. I will never use rope again. As mentioned just bring the cylinder/piston being worked on up to TDC as a safety margin. If the valve drops it isn't going very far this way and can just be pulled back up no biggie.

    I say no ropes!
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  23. #22
    call da amberlamps Zach90Turbo's Avatar
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    www.toyotool.com

    Compressed air does the trick. I used to just leave the piston at TDC and let the friction from the valve seal hold it in place, but then you have to compress the spring that much further for the locks to pop into place. With compressed air and the toyotool it's pretty easy, even with upgraded single springs. Haven't done double springs in-car yet, don't know that I want to.

  24. #23
    Is it turbo? Is it stick? TROLL's Avatar
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    Watched the toyotool vid... they sure make it look easy.

    First question is... can you use that method to install aftermarket stiffer valve springs? From what I've read it seems like its not quite that easy. If it isn't that simple, then what do you recommend?

    Second question is... what all needs to be purchased from toyotool? Looks like the 6mm Valve Tool is what they use in the vid, and the Valve Seal Pliers. Whats the Complete Fixture Set all about, and are any other tools necessary?

    Thanks...

  25. #24
    What about the toe? Patrick94TT's Avatar
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    I gave up on the ToyoTool after two hours of trying to get the first spring in. Of course, I'm a pretty skinny guy, so some of you muscly guys may have a better experience with it, but it's way easy slip it and have the keepers shoot out, and the upgraded springs are SOOOOO much stiffer than stock. I'd just pull the head, use the spring compressor that attaches to the head, and save yourself a lot of headache. Good idea to replace the head gasket after that huge build you just went through too Tavo.

  26. #25
    Speed limits = Guidelines suprant0010's Avatar
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    if you do wind up taking the head off...make sure you lap the valves...its good policy to always do that when the engines apart, and will make for a much better running engine

    that alone is reason enough for me to take it off

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