t56 tranny swap

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  1. #1

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    t56 tranny swap

    I posted this in the southwestern regional part as well. As are trannies are getting more expensive and harder to come by a company called arizona performane is looking for a donor mkiv 6speed to mok-up a T-56 conversion kit for us. They can be reached at arizonaperformance@cox.net

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    HardTopper Matty95'Coupe's Avatar
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    Cool idea, V160 can handle a shitload more power though...

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    True, but for about half the price you can halve a six speed.. the only thing catchy is that will the conversion be worth it?
    24lbs of boost and decreasing >:)

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    HardTopper Matty95'Coupe's Avatar
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    Hopefully this will come to fruition and we'll see! I'm deff curious, I already have a V160, but still interested, just not enough to "donate" it haha...

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    Moderator Wreckless's Avatar
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    A T56 swap is pointless unless you can match (preferably undercut) the cost of an R154 5-spd swap. The R154 can be done with a couple simple mods and otherwise all Toyota OEM parts. It also uses an external slave cylinder not a POS internal slave cylinder like the LS1 T56's.

    But I'll be sticking to my 7-second proven Getrag V160
    Jeff
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    SupraForums Member 11C20's Avatar
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    ^^^^ I was just about to ask how strong the T56's are compared to the Getrag and how much if any better than the R154.
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    HardTopper Matty95'Coupe's Avatar
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    Good point Wreckless! I'd rather have an R154 than a T56 too... Likewise the R154 can handle more power than a T56 too. I never knew they had an internal slave that sucks... LS1 guys complain about the forks sucking too I guess they bend with an upgraded clutch. Also they snap tailshafts in the 450-500hp range, granted they have more torque than an equal HP supra but shit... Age old saying "you get what you pay for" and I'd pay for another V160 if I had to do it again.

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    The whole point of this is to replace the getrag. The v160 can handle alot of power its been proven time and time again, but no matter how strong they are they still wear out. My v160 has 100,000 miles on it with a completely stock car and the tranny grinds shifting from 2nd into thrd. The cost for these transmission keep getting higher and higher. Summit racing sells a T-56 that can handle 700ftlbs of trq for $2700 and they can be rebuilt by just about anyone for $500.

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    Assistant M*derator Hurrakaine's Avatar
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    ^ for the price of that, you could have 7 R154's that can handle the same power.
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  11. #10
    Moderator Wreckless's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jafo101 View Post
    The whole point of this is to replace the getrag. The v160 can handle alot of power its been proven time and time again, but no matter how strong they are they still wear out. My v160 has 100,000 miles on it with a completely stock car and the tranny grinds shifting from 2nd into thrd. The cost for these transmission keep getting higher and higher. Summit racing sells a T-56 that can handle 700ftlbs of trq for $2700 and they can be rebuilt by just about anyone for $500.
    *REPLACE* a Getrag?!?!? Are you high?
    Why not get your Getrag rebuilt for less than that T56, and have a 7 second proven buttery smooth awesome 6-spd for the next 100k miles?

    So you'd spend $2700 on a trans, a fuckload of time/money on a custom driveshaft, flywheel, clutch & clutch fork/release setup, custom bellhousing, slave cylinder setup (hope it's an external one!) crossmember, etc etc it goes on. Then you've got a double overdrive 6-spd that'll get along with the V160's 3.133:1 rear end ratio about as well as Tabasco sauce & vaginas do.
    So now you've gotta go down to the smaller 200mm ring gear TT auto/NA diff pattern to get a final drive ratio that's worth a shit with a T56. Granted, you could sell the grindy Getrag, 6-spd driveshaft, clutch, and diff.
    So
    $2k going rate for grindy getrag
    $400 for DS
    $1k for diff
    $500-1000 for your clutch depending.

    So you've got 4K in your pocket. So you buy that T56 from Summit and you've got $1300. Then you need a custom bellhousing to make the T56 bolt to a 2JZGTE. Say you go the cheap route and do a simple plate conversion for $500 or so. Then you get a clutch *and* flywheel set up for real power to suit your wacky custom combo that's all 100% custom, which isn't going to be cheap and we both know it. Call it $1k and that's being REAL conservative.
    Now we're $200 in the red. Then you need a custom driveshaft to suit, also not cheap for strong stuff but we'll call it cheap at $500. Then you need to go buy a TT auto or NA rear diff with a decent LSD, be real generous and say it's $1k. Now we're $1700 in the red and we're not even counting all the cussing and fucking around that goes with making an engine, trans, & clutch all get along when they were never meant to.

    At which point you've got a Getrag's rebuild's worth of money into an inferior driveline and a fuckload of back-and-forth making it work and machine shop costs and all the other shit involved.

    If you've got all that stuff and can fabricate all that stuff, good for you. Use it to do work to buy the right stuff to keep your Supra at it's best, most valuable, and (most importantly) most enjoyable to drive.
    Because even if you can break even money-wise to have a T56 into your Supra, your Supra just took a 5k hit in market value.

    The T56 might be a worthwhile conversion to someone going from W58 or R154.
    But a T56 replacing the Getrag is fucking stupid. Always has been, always will be. End of story.

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    Your absolutely right It would take alot of effort fitting a T-56 tranny. But options are getting fewer and fewer. 5 years ago did you think a v160 would sell for 7 grand? what about 4 dollars for a gallon of gas? My point is in another 5 years these trannies arent going to be around. I could have mine rebuilt for about $3500 but when doing a search, alot of people arent happy with the rebuilds. So then you look for used ones but you never know what kind of condition there in. Right now this shop is looking for a donor car to try to figure this out. In the end if it doesnt work out, at least we tried.

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    HardTopper Matty95'Coupe's Avatar
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    ^^ Wreckless FTW lol... OP I have a fully swapped NA, I put the V160 in after I had fun breaking my W58 in half... Listening to all arguments even if your theoretical swap was available I still wouldn't go back and change that, my 2nd-3rd grinds too (bad 3rd gear syncro) getting it rebuilt for about 800$ fOr now double clutch works very well most people can't even tell I'm doing it

  14. #13
    SupraForums Member ophidicus's Avatar
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    If your going with Tremec at least go with a TKO600 they are way stronger than a T56 and can hold 600 Trq all day long but I digress as an R154 would be way easier to swap in and makes way more sense.
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    Twin Meister KenHenderson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wreckless View Post
    *REPLACE* a Getrag?!?!? Are you high?
    Why not get your Getrag rebuilt for less than that T56, and have a 7 second proven buttery smooth awesome 6-spd for the next 100k miles?

    So you'd spend $2700 on a trans, a fuckload of time/money on a custom driveshaft, flywheel, clutch & clutch fork/release setup, custom bellhousing, slave cylinder setup (hope it's an external one!) crossmember, etc etc it goes on. Then you've got a double overdrive 6-spd that'll get along with the V160's 3.133:1 rear end ratio about as well as Tabasco sauce & vaginas do.
    So now you've gotta go down to the smaller 200mm ring gear TT auto/NA diff pattern to get a final drive ratio that's worth a shit with a T56. Granted, you could sell the grindy Getrag, 6-spd driveshaft, clutch, and diff.
    So
    $2k going rate for grindy getrag
    $400 for DS
    $1k for diff
    $500-1000 for your clutch depending.

    So you've got 4K in your pocket. So you buy that T56 from Summit and you've got $1300. Then you need a custom bellhousing to make the T56 bolt to a 2JZGTE. Say you go the cheap route and do a simple plate conversion for $500 or so. Then you get a clutch *and* flywheel set up for real power to suit your wacky custom combo that's all 100% custom, which isn't going to be cheap and we both know it. Call it $1k and that's being REAL conservative.
    Now we're $200 in the red. Then you need a custom driveshaft to suit, also not cheap for strong stuff but we'll call it cheap at $500. Then you need to go buy a TT auto or NA rear diff with a decent LSD, be real generous and say it's $1k. Now we're $1700 in the red and we're not even counting all the cussing and fucking around that goes with making an engine, trans, & clutch all get along when they were never meant to.

    At which point you've got a Getrag's rebuild's worth of money into an inferior driveline and a fuckload of back-and-forth making it work and machine shop costs and all the other shit involved.

    If you've got all that stuff and can fabricate all that stuff, good for you. Use it to do work to buy the right stuff to keep your Supra at it's best, most valuable, and (most importantly) most enjoyable to drive.
    Because even if you can break even money-wise to have a T56 into your Supra, your Supra just took a 5k hit in market value.

    The T56 might be a worthwhile conversion to someone going from W58 or R154.
    But a T56 replacing the Getrag is fucking stupid. Always has been, always will be. End of story.
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  16. #15
    SupraForums Member Kracin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jafo101 View Post
    Your absolutely right It would take alot of effort fitting a T-56 tranny. But options are getting fewer and fewer. 5 years ago did you think a v160 would sell for 7 grand? what about 4 dollars for a gallon of gas? My point is in another 5 years these trannies arent going to be around. I could have mine rebuilt for about $3500 but when doing a search, alot of people arent happy with the rebuilds. So then you look for used ones but you never know what kind of condition there in. Right now this shop is looking for a donor car to try to figure this out. In the end if it doesnt work out, at least we tried.
    there are lots of trannies left.

    think about it this way.

    for every car that gets wrecked, a tranny gets sold. the transmissions outlive the cars by far, in the end, there will be more transmissions left, than supras

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    HardTopper Matty95'Coupe's Avatar
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    Plus OP 3,500$ for your rebuild is pretty freaking steep, (I have the same 3rd gear syncro prob as u my re-builds gonna be 800$) I got a used V160 wi 30K miles for 3,400

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    Quote Originally Posted by jafo101 View Post
    The whole point of this is to replace the getrag. The v160 can handle alot of power its been proven time and time again, but no matter how strong they are they still wear out. My v160 has 100,000 miles on it with a completely stock car and the tranny grinds shifting from 2nd into thrd. The cost for these transmission keep getting higher and higher. Summit racing sells a T-56 that can handle 700ftlbs of trq for $2700 and they can be rebuilt by just about anyone for $500.
    I trade you my r154 with marling crawler internals for your grinding v160
    618 whp 492 ft @ 22 psi (Low Boost)on pump gas ,
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  19. #18
    ELITECUSTOMBODY exvelocity's Avatar
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    Jeff, da man! Right on us usual.


    OP,not too long ago I was thinking of buying all 6 speed transmissions that Toyota had in stock nationwide,thinking that supply was very low and prices going up,since Getrag filed bankrupcy ,I had a friend of mine ,that runs local Toyota parts department check if there were 50 transmissions were available, the answer was "yes",so I had him check if there were 100 available,sure enough, they had plenty, needless to say I didn't want to follow through with my idea.

    BTW, I want to go the opposite in a way,lol .I've been thinking of running V160 with LS6 motor in my 69 Firebird
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    SupraForums Member turbomike76's Avatar
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    How about the tranny in the new 5.0 mustang? It's a getrag Mt82... Has anyone looked into these units for a replacement for the supra?? Just throwing it out their... I really don't know much about these mt82"s

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    SupraForums Member Griffon's Avatar
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    Jafo101 are you going to be selling your v160? I could use it to replace my w58 in my na-t, grinding or not its got to be better then the w58
    1993.5 Toyota Supra TT 6 speed! Stock for now ;)
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  22. #21
    SupraForums Member 11C20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by turbomike76 View Post
    How about the tranny in the new 5.0 mustang? It's a getrag Mt82... Has anyone looked into these units for a replacement for the supra?? Just throwing it out their... I really don't know much about these mt82"s
    Not sure what the pricing is on those and plus not sure if anyone knows the limits etc.... I'm sure in time more info will become available.

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    The amount of work and time involved in finding a replacement and getting it to work simply isn't worth it.. Just get a rebuild and enjoy your day. If you're one of the auto guys going to a V160.. it'll be well worth it if you just save and go with the 6spd that BELONGS in your car, or like someone mentioned above, the R154 is a few hundred bucks and handles plenty of power for a street friendly setup for someone on a budget. Anything else just seems like a waste of time.

  24. #23
    Proud MKIII Owner 871JZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jafo101 View Post
    I could have mine rebuilt for about $3500
    Are you having that thing gold plated or something?
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  25. #24
    GOT BOOST? 2JZ_MA70's Avatar
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    I dont know where you get the idea that the T56 is fragile... Yes if you go for the stock camaro or mustang transmission you will break it easy.....
    I see vipers putting way more torque than any supra will ever make through those fragile t-56 transmission and occasionally they do break but at that power level you probably will be splitting the case on the v160...

    The T-56 Magnum is like all the best parts of the T-56 family in one package... It has hydro pump, viper spec input and output shafts, custom gear ratio's, updated shiftforks etc...

    If you think that the r-154 can handle anything over 600lb of torque you are on borrowed time. Even with upgrades the wear in the transmission is so accelerated its just stupid. Put a aggressive clutch and good tires with one piece drive-shaft and you are going to spit gears all over. I have done it 3 times. Each costing me ~$1000 to rebuild.

    Realistically if you look at torque ratings the R was rated at 280lb the (Getrag transmissions similar to the v160 are rated at ~400lb) So 700 manufacturer rating is not that bad.

    As far as the money aspect of it... You posted it just right...
    Your existing parts are ~2500-5000 depending on condition.
    The transmission is a wash... (worse case)
    1.Bellhousing Quick Time ~600 (SFI 6.1)
    2.Clutch... either respline the disk or get new one... Custom or not its the same price... 7" quarter master multiplate will cost you ~1000 If you get 1JZ Spec Super Twin ~1500 new or 600-700 used. No matter what you spend on the clutch you have to do the same on the V-160. So cost will offset.
    3.Shaftmasters.com will get you get you aluminum drive-shaft for ~400
    4. Transmission Mount... That is tricky as no one has fabricated one.
    5. Shifter location...
    6. Hydro TOB McLeod ~400

    total cost is 4000-5500

    Is it for everyone? no its not... But you make it sound like its totally out of the question. Also you are getting new vs used/rebuild. SFI 6.1 Bellhousing that will save your legs if the clutch explodes!!! People spend more than that on the clutch alone....
    Full swap for the V-160 new is $5000 for the trans $1000 clutch/flywheel, $500 drive-shaft,....

  26. #25
    SupraForums Member Kracin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2JZ_MA70 View Post
    I dont know where you get the idea that the T56 is fragile... Yes if you go for the stock camaro or mustang transmission you will break it easy.....
    I see vipers putting way more torque than any supra will ever make through those fragile t-56 transmission and occasionally they do break but at that power level you probably will be splitting the case on the v160...

    The T-56 Magnum is like all the best parts of the T-56 family in one package... It has hydro pump, viper spec input and output shafts, custom gear ratio's, updated shiftforks etc...

    If you think that the r-154 can handle anything over 600lb of torque you are on borrowed time. Even with upgrades the wear in the transmission is so accelerated its just stupid. Put a aggressive clutch and good tires with one piece drive-shaft and you are going to spit gears all over. I have done it 3 times. Each costing me ~$1000 to rebuild.

    Realistically if you look at torque ratings the R was rated at 280lb the (Getrag transmissions similar to the v160 are rated at ~400lb) So 700 manufacturer rating is not that bad.

    As far as the money aspect of it... You posted it just right...
    Your existing parts are ~2500-5000 depending on condition.
    The transmission is a wash... (worse case)
    1.Bellhousing Quick Time ~600 (SFI 6.1)
    2.Clutch... either respline the disk or get new one... Custom or not its the same price... 7" quarter master multiplate will cost you ~1000 If you get 1JZ Spec Super Twin ~1500 new or 600-700 used. No matter what you spend on the clutch you have to do the same on the V-160. So cost will offset.
    3.Shaftmasters.com will get you get you aluminum drive-shaft for ~400
    4. Transmission Mount... That is tricky as no one has fabricated one.
    5. Shifter location...
    6. Hydro TOB McLeod ~400

    total cost is 4000-5500

    Is it for everyone? no its not... But you make it sound like its totally out of the question. Also you are getting new vs used/rebuild. SFI 6.1 Bellhousing that will save your legs if the clutch explodes!!! People spend more than that on the clutch alone....
    Full swap for the V-160 new is $5000 for the trans $1000 clutch/flywheel, $500 drive-shaft,....

    fyi... supras are putting down more power on v160s than the vipers are on t56s


    why would you care about torque if its going in a supra.. stop making excuses, its a shitty idea


    600hp is borrow time on an r154? you don't even know what you are talking about and want to make ridiculous claims lol, even if you have screwed up 3 transmissions. hooking with sticky tires and a driveshaft with no give combined with bad driving... of course you can screw up a trans. enough hard launches the wrong way and youll have to rebuild a v160 too, ive seen those happen also... not to mention you can pick up marlin crawler race r154s for a lot less than a t56 and still be able to handle as much.
    Last edited by Kracin; 04-21-2011 at 05:04 AM.

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