[Captain]

They make decent golf clubs, too.

Amplifiers aren't too shabby either.

 

[TheProPilot]

This doesn't add or subtract from the conversation but the 1ZZ literally has Yamahahahaha stamped on the head where you can see it.

 

[JoeSupra]

Why would a company with a easily recognized and trademarked name and brand allow the use of that name and brand on a product they had little or nothing to do with?

Yamaha did a lot of cylinder head development for the vast majority of if not all of Toyota's performance engines.

They have it on the 1jz and that's my point. I believe they didnt have involvement because it's not anywhere to be found on the 2jz. Plus the fact we cant find any evidence either.

1jzvvti has YAMAHA on the cover. If you are saying no to it being on the 1j. A quick google search can find those pics everywhere

I was saying no to the 2jz.

 

[Wreckless]

They have it on the 1jz and that's my point. I believe they didnt have involvement because it's not anywhere to be found on the 2jz. Plus the fact we cant find any evidence either.

Joe - I'm telling you, that if you had non-VVTi 1JZ-GTE and 2JZ-GTE heads stripped and sitting side by side, you would agree that if one of them is 'Yamaha' then the other one is, too. Who knows why there's Yamaha on the 1JZ's but not the 2JZ's - the fundamental points are:
-Yamaha had a proven collaboration with Toyota for a lot of engine development, and still does.
-Whether or not one is 'Yamaha' and the other is not is irrelevant in the context of the BMW vs Toyota MK5 discussion, because they are both Japanese companies and all of the Yamayota/Toyomaha cylinder heads/engines/whateverthefuck were all cast, machined, and assembled in Japan on Japanese tooling to that legendary 90's Toyota standard of production quality. None of that is true about the MK5.

So if someone is saying there's precedence to Toyota collaborating on projects the correct answer is yes.
But if they're implying that justifies the idea of selling a 100% BMW designed-to-explode-in-36k miles heap that's made in Austria, and pretending it's the same or better than a ToyYamaYotaMaha JZ collaboration that was all built by Toyota in-house, they're smoking shit so good that they probably think using a Fleshlight counts as getting laid.

 

[SupraPolak]

For what it's worth...

I googled and translated a couple Japanese sites and found the following:

Design of Yamaha Motor only 1 JZ-GTE among JZ . Nevertheless, Toyota manufactures components such as engine block casting .

There is no involvement of Yamaha Motor in other JZ, especially 2JZ series.

and

1JZ-GTE - The engine which was designed exclusively by Yamaha Motor in the JZ series . Although it is based on 1 JZ - GE, there are very few common parts from the cylinder head to the connecting rod. Production also produced machined parts at Toyota Motor , and was in a different structure than other JZ engines, which Yamaha Motor is in charge of.

also

In the JZ series, Yamaha was responsible for designing only 1 JZ.

2JZ is manufactured by Toyota.
http: //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%83%88%E3%83%A8%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BBJZ ...

I tried quite well on my Supra Catalog and materials However, I did not mention Yamaha as a word.

1JZ-GTE

1JZ-GTE VVTi

Toyota JZX100

Toyota JZX110

 

[05on94]

1JZ-GTE

 

[Bprice_95]

The beams were developed by yamaha, then toyota did their thing, then went back to yamaha for the 1j r&d, the 1j was all yamaha, toyota thanked them, reverse engineered, refined, added some displacement, and voila.. 2j's, so in my opinion the 2j was a yamaha designed motor that yamaha had no part in the production of, so to answer your question, no, theres no evidence to yamahas involvement cuz they werent involved. But i love yamaha, always have, love supras too lol, but we probably wouldnt have the supra period if yamaha and nissan hadnt teamed up to make a sports car amd nissan bailed to go focus on the 240z, leaving yamaha with 351 2000gt's so they reached out to toyota. So i think had nissan and yamaha not had that falling out then toyota wouldnt have got its "groundbreaking sports car" and nissan and yamaha wouldve stayed close and there would probably be 1j's in skylines

 

[Faba80]

Just made a account to reply to this very interesting thread!

From my research this is what I found:

From what I have gathered the 1JZ-GE/GTE was entirely designed and produced by Yamaha and built on Yamaha supply lines and was based off a "Toyota engine". Probably referring to a early design of the 1JZ. The 1JZ was a "Toyota joint development and production contract"..

My opinion:
This could potentially explain the YAMAHA stamp on these engines. They also co-developed and designed the 3SGTE (not just the head) with Toyota hence the stamp on the engine cover.

(not sure on this part) From what I can see there is no stamp on a 4-age? however it is quite clear that YAMAHA did design the head for this engine. The engine is clearly a A series engine made by Toyota hence why I think there is no stamp on the engine as Yamaha only designed the head.

Moving forward, most if not all Japanese websites state that the 2JZ was not developed by Yamaha. However the 2JZ being derived from the 1JZ built by Yamaha means that it is arguable a Yamaha designed engine. Furthermore most Japanese websites also state Toyota engines with a -GE code are Toyota's performance heads which have all been designed by Yamaha, again this could be incorrect as it just peoples assumptions and opinions as Toyota never stated this. (or I cant find where they have).
I believe the 1JZ was outsourced to Yamaha, whereas the 2JZ was built inhouse so in my opinion, the 2JZ in its entirety is a Toyota engine derived from the Yamaha designed 1JZ... with potentially a Yamaha worked head..

 

[signalpuke]

Yamaha has a history of designing/making heads for OEMs. Whether their name is on it is probably a money thing, just like with books and authors (ghost writers). Similar to Cosworth for a lot of engines, or Lotus for suspension design.

I'd anticipate that mostly all performance engines in the 90's were a collaboration. RB engines in the GTR's, Rotary RX-7, Honda/Acura Vtec in the NSX, and finally our 2JZ I6.

I think the 'world motor' takes the cake for this, DSM cross platforming into all kinds of chassis, from rally cars to shitbox econo cars and pick up trucks.
The RX7 was pretty much just Mazda, and all of the Honda stuff was in house. Their motors until this century spun backwards compared to everyone else.

 

[7passu]

This is a good thread. Let's keep it going. The new LC 500 engine also have Yamaha casted into the back of the heads

 

[Nomienos]

Just wondering, do you have any sources? I don't mean to be an ass just saying I've always heard about the head being touched up by Yamaha but never read it first hand.

 

[john37]

"But if they're implying that justifies the idea of selling a 100% BMW designed-to-explode-in-36k miles heap that's made in Austria, and pretending it's the same or better than a ToyYamaYotaMaha JZ collaboration that was all built by Toyota in-house, they're smoking shit so good that they probably think using a Fleshlight counts as getting laid"

bmw b58 and s58 is superior to the 2jz on just about any metric. they are solid, powerful, lightweight and very effective. 34mpg highway compared of 21 of the old supra. ofc this is somewhat related to the modern automatic transmissions as well

 

[MkivOldStock]

"bmw b58 and s58 is superior to the 2jz on just about any metric. they are solid, powerful, lightweight and very effective. 34mpg highway compared of 21 of the old supra. ofc this is somewhat related to the modern automatic transmissions as well

I find that argument hard to verify since many bmw engines tend to require extensive maintenance just to keep them from leaving oil marks on your driveway. Many engine parts are made of plastic with inferior seals that like to leak and difficult to get to. Not to mention those engines have an aluminum block and hold half the power a cast iron 2JZ can take.

They have newer technology of course and are much more responsive engines. The lightweight blocks definitely help with a better center of gravity. Can’t say I’m giddy about the auto transmissions with no option for a true manual.

This is, an MKIV-biased forum you’re posting in after all….

 

[FastTurbo]

"But if they're implying that justifies the idea of selling a 100% BMW designed-to-explode-in-36k miles heap that's made in Austria, and pretending it's the same or better than a ToyYamaYotaMaha JZ collaboration that was all built by Toyota in-house, they're smoking shit so good that they probably think using a Fleshlight counts as getting laid"

bmw b58 and s58 is superior to the 2jz on just about any metric. they are solid, powerful, lightweight and very effective. 34mpg highway compared of 21 of the old supra. ofc this is somewhat related to the modern automatic transmissions as well

You joined to bump this thread for the first time in a year for this. Congrats u win at the internet.

 

[95MKIVTT]

bmw b58 and s58 is superior to the 2jz on just about any metric. they are solid, powerful, lightweight and very effective. 34mpg highway compared of 21 of the old supra. ofc this is somewhat related to the modern automatic transmissions as well

oh great another ricer. BUTTERS!!!!(@awegrzyn )keep your people in check, they are not welcome here.

 

[Wreckless]

"But if they're implying that justifies the idea of selling a 100% BMW designed-to-explode-in-36k miles heap that's made in Austria, and pretending it's the same or better than a ToyYamaYotaMaha JZ collaboration that was all built by Toyota in-house, they're smoking shit so good that they probably think using a Fleshlight counts as getting laid"

bmw b58 and s58 is superior to the 2jz on just about any metric. they are solid, powerful, lightweight and very effective. 34mpg highway compared of 21 of the old supra. ofc this is somewhat related to the modern automatic transmissions as well

Check out that Supra MKV forum thread on it. 'Cars Excessively Burning Oil'

2021's having a 30%+ rate of piston failure, overwhemlingly at ~sub-4k miles and completely stock?

ENGINE OF AWESOME. SUCH MPG. MANY BOOSTS.

 

[FastTurbo]

Check out that Supra MKV forum thread on it. 'Cars Excessively Burning Oil' View attachment 262906

2021's having a 30%+ rate of piston failure, overwhemlingly at ~sub-4k miles and completely stock?

ENGINE OF AWESOME. SUCH MPG. MANY BOOSTS.

But Jeff, oil consumption is also known as being awesome tax.

 

[Wreckless]

But Jeff, oil consumption is also known as being awesome tax.

I think you misread all that, my friend - the 'awesome tax' is our plebian low-mid 20 mpg on the highway in our shitty ancient 2JZ cars.

I think the 'MKV tax' is all the wasted time, effort, and energy when you have to get it bought back under US Lemon Laws. I know personally of 4 2021 models that were lemon law'd because of engine failure; bad pistons or piston rings. In those four cases the engine took between 2 and 5 months to replace, and the car never acted right again; powertrain issues, reduced power codes, DME/ECU freaking out over various things, etc.
I've heard similar trends of MKV owners dealing with repeated returns for various BMW electronics problems, and getting out of the car as fast as they can.

They're genuinely fantastic to drive when they're running well or you 'got a good one' that doesn't have DME issues or a dud engine. But that's a set of BMW expectations to match a BMW product.

 

[Piratetip]

Are they swapping out the contaminated CAT's also when they swap the oil burning engine?

Or does the failing CAT CEL come on 2 years later?

 

[Mr Ree NZ]

Those two issues are not related... 🤣