Brake Fluid???
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3,148 Posts
Motul 600
You don't need it and you won't be able to tell the difference on the street, but you may as use quality stuff on a Supra.
Later, Steve
You don't need it and you won't be able to tell the difference on the street, but you may as use quality stuff on a Supra.
Later, Steve
Joined
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259 Posts
Best Brake fluid is Valvoline Synthetic, if you're doing a majority of street driving and moderate amount of racing.
Check out this analysis:
Brand Wet(F) Dry(F) Cost Note
Castrol GT LMA 325 490 $
ATE Super DOT 4 356 500 ?
Motul 5.1 365 509 $$
Valvoline Syn-Powe 333 513 $
ATE Typ 200(super blue) 392 536 $$
AP Racing 550 284 550 $$$
Ford HD 284 550 $
Performance Friction Z 284 550 $$
Wilwood 570 284 570 $$
AP Racing 600 284 572 $$$$ Race
Motul 600 421/392* 585 $$$ Race
Castrol SRF 518 590 $$$$$ Race
Price scale is as follows:
$ $3.00 per 500ml approximate retail
$$ $7
$$$ $10
$$$$ $20
$$$$$ $40+
* Motul 600 421 typ wet, 392 min wet
Remember, use the dry reading for real racing, where the brakes are bled before each event. For street use, use the wet reading.
Ash
'93 SUPRA TT BPU
Check out this analysis:
Brand Wet(F) Dry(F) Cost Note
Castrol GT LMA 325 490 $
ATE Super DOT 4 356 500 ?
Motul 5.1 365 509 $$
Valvoline Syn-Powe 333 513 $
ATE Typ 200(super blue) 392 536 $$
AP Racing 550 284 550 $$$
Ford HD 284 550 $
Performance Friction Z 284 550 $$
Wilwood 570 284 570 $$
AP Racing 600 284 572 $$$$ Race
Motul 600 421/392* 585 $$$ Race
Castrol SRF 518 590 $$$$$ Race
Price scale is as follows:
$ $3.00 per 500ml approximate retail
$$ $7
$$$ $10
$$$$ $20
$$$$$ $40+
* Motul 600 421 typ wet, 392 min wet
Remember, use the dry reading for real racing, where the brakes are bled before each event. For street use, use the wet reading.
Ash
'93 SUPRA TT BPU
Joined
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259 Posts
Ok this came out pretty shitty.
E-mail me if you want to see the excel file.
Ash
'93 SUPRA TT BPU
E-mail me if you want to see the excel file.
Ash
'93 SUPRA TT BPU
Joined
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3,148 Posts
Keep in mind that you can flush the whole Supra system with 2 bottles (around $20). Your spending an incremental $14 to get a 26% increase in wet boiling point (which is what matters on a street car) and 14% increase in dry boiling point.
Later, Steve
Later, Steve
Joined
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259 Posts
Steve,
Are you talking about the Valvoline Syntec?
Ash
'93 SURPA TT BPU
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1,293 Posts
Ash/SupraStar2000
Stupid question.... Those figures you posted, the higher the number the better, right?
Andi,
Do you know of any place online that I could order Motiul 600, maybe not by the case.
How many bottles would I need, to do a complete flush and refill?
thanks
Enrique M.
97TT 6spd
Stupid question.... Those figures you posted, the higher the number the better, right?
Andi,
Do you know of any place online that I could order Motiul 600, maybe not by the case.
How many bottles would I need, to do a complete flush and refill?
thanks
Enrique M.
97TT 6spd
G
Guest
·motul is very good stuff but it should be bleeded more often. if your a lazy guy, i wouldn't recomend it. otherwise, its the best besides for the price.
Joined
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3,148 Posts
SupraStar2000,
Yes I was comparing it to the Valvoline.
kingerm,
If you completely drain the resevoir you do it with 2 bottles. This even includes the slave cylinder. You may want to buy 3 bottles just to be sure.
RanGer498,
I used to use the same thing, but the first time I went to the track the pedal went directly to the floor after about 2 fast laps. This was on a track that isn't hard on brakes. This let me realize how close I was to boiling this fluid even on the street. Good price, nut not good fluid.
TVRsupra,
I bleed mine about twice per year, but I know Michelin/BFGoodrich only bleeds the it on their test vehicles one a year. That should be plenty on a street car.
Later, Steve
Yes I was comparing it to the Valvoline.
kingerm,
If you completely drain the resevoir you do it with 2 bottles. This even includes the slave cylinder. You may want to buy 3 bottles just to be sure.
RanGer498,
I used to use the same thing, but the first time I went to the track the pedal went directly to the floor after about 2 fast laps. This was on a track that isn't hard on brakes. This let me realize how close I was to boiling this fluid even on the street. Good price, nut not good fluid.
TVRsupra,
I bleed mine about twice per year, but I know Michelin/BFGoodrich only bleeds the it on their test vehicles one a year. That should be plenty on a street car.
Later, Steve
Joined
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259 Posts
Kingerm,
Yes, the higher the number, the better.
Ash
'93 SUPRA TT BPU
Yes, the higher the number, the better.
Ash
'93 SUPRA TT BPU
G
Guest
·How/what methods/techniques are you using to bleed the brakes?
TIA,
Brian
TIA,
Brian
Try this
The following is based on recommendations made by brake guru Mac Tilton. Mac is best known as the man that brought Carbon pads and rotors to racing. He is also the owner of Tilton Engineering; one of the main suppliers of brakes and clutches to Indy and F-1.
When bleeding brakes it is best to manually bleed them as pressure bleeders can cause cavitation and bubbles inside the system. Empty the brake reservoir with a turkey baster then fill the reservoir with a high quality brake fluid. Start bleeding at the furthest wheel away from the M/C and progress to the closest. So that would go RR, LR, RF, LF. Attach a length of clear Tigon tubing (available form any auto parts store) to the bleeder nipple, put the other end of the line into some sort of container so the other end will be submerged in brake fluid and open the nipple. Have someone in the car to pump the brakes. Slowly pump all of the old fluid out of the line until new clear fluid comes out, then have the person in the car hold the pedal down while you close the bleeder. Have the person lift the pedal up slowly and then push down slowly while you open the nipple. You have to communicate with the pumper because the bleeder should only be open on the down stroke of the brake pedal. It is important to pump slowly to avoid bubble-forming cavitation. Continue to pump until you cannot observe any bubbles in the clear Tigon tube.
Get a rubber mallet and tap the caliper to dislodge any bubbles that may be stuck inside the caliper and bleed some more until no more bubbles come out. Do this at all the wheels and you are done. Be careful not to let the reservoir run dry or you will have to start all over. On ABS equipped cars you want to be extra careful about this because it takes forever and a lot of fluid to bleed a completely dry ABS system.
I found this info on the web...hope it helps.
Jeff
The following is based on recommendations made by brake guru Mac Tilton. Mac is best known as the man that brought Carbon pads and rotors to racing. He is also the owner of Tilton Engineering; one of the main suppliers of brakes and clutches to Indy and F-1.
When bleeding brakes it is best to manually bleed them as pressure bleeders can cause cavitation and bubbles inside the system. Empty the brake reservoir with a turkey baster then fill the reservoir with a high quality brake fluid. Start bleeding at the furthest wheel away from the M/C and progress to the closest. So that would go RR, LR, RF, LF. Attach a length of clear Tigon tubing (available form any auto parts store) to the bleeder nipple, put the other end of the line into some sort of container so the other end will be submerged in brake fluid and open the nipple. Have someone in the car to pump the brakes. Slowly pump all of the old fluid out of the line until new clear fluid comes out, then have the person in the car hold the pedal down while you close the bleeder. Have the person lift the pedal up slowly and then push down slowly while you open the nipple. You have to communicate with the pumper because the bleeder should only be open on the down stroke of the brake pedal. It is important to pump slowly to avoid bubble-forming cavitation. Continue to pump until you cannot observe any bubbles in the clear Tigon tube.
Get a rubber mallet and tap the caliper to dislodge any bubbles that may be stuck inside the caliper and bleed some more until no more bubbles come out. Do this at all the wheels and you are done. Be careful not to let the reservoir run dry or you will have to start all over. On ABS equipped cars you want to be extra careful about this because it takes forever and a lot of fluid to bleed a completely dry ABS system.
I found this info on the web...hope it helps.
Jeff
Joined
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1,432 Posts
Lots of great information here. The boiling point list is useful. Might want to include stock Toyota temps on there for reference.
To see the problems with replies to this thread you just have to read the guy's initial question.
"What brake fluid do you guys recommend using for a 94 TT? I have stock pads and rotors and dont road race at all."
Without doubt, Motul 600 is an outstanding brake fluid. Does it suit his needs? Hell no. Motul 600 is massive overkill for him. Compared to stock fluid it's very expensive. Motul 600 is also considerably more hydroscopic (absorbs moisture) than stock or "lesser" synthetic DOT 4 fluids. This means he will have to bleed them more often. More work, more money. I seriously doubt this guy or anyone else is going to boil over good stock fluid while driving on the street. Nothing else is gained by going to a better fluid.
This being said, I will never use stock brake fluid in my car again. I on the other hand, have and do occasionally roadrace - albeit not often. With brand new stock fluid, pads, and rotors I boiled the brake fluid in the calipers on a tight track (Hallsville Raceway FYI) after about 4 hard braking laps. I ran off the ******* track ater the 120mph straight when my brakes failed! After boiling, you won't get to play for the rest of the day as the heat just stays there and I'm sure the fluid is rather unsuitable as well. I bled with Valvoline Synthetic when I got home and what looked like milk came out. I'm going to do a fresh bleed with Valvoline Synthetic with hopes it will work better next month at Hallsville Raceway.
John H
To see the problems with replies to this thread you just have to read the guy's initial question.
"What brake fluid do you guys recommend using for a 94 TT? I have stock pads and rotors and dont road race at all."
Without doubt, Motul 600 is an outstanding brake fluid. Does it suit his needs? Hell no. Motul 600 is massive overkill for him. Compared to stock fluid it's very expensive. Motul 600 is also considerably more hydroscopic (absorbs moisture) than stock or "lesser" synthetic DOT 4 fluids. This means he will have to bleed them more often. More work, more money. I seriously doubt this guy or anyone else is going to boil over good stock fluid while driving on the street. Nothing else is gained by going to a better fluid.
This being said, I will never use stock brake fluid in my car again. I on the other hand, have and do occasionally roadrace - albeit not often. With brand new stock fluid, pads, and rotors I boiled the brake fluid in the calipers on a tight track (Hallsville Raceway FYI) after about 4 hard braking laps. I ran off the ******* track ater the 120mph straight when my brakes failed! After boiling, you won't get to play for the rest of the day as the heat just stays there and I'm sure the fluid is rather unsuitable as well. I bled with Valvoline Synthetic when I got home and what looked like milk came out. I'm going to do a fresh bleed with Valvoline Synthetic with hopes it will work better next month at Hallsville Raceway.
John H
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