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Cartographer
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2,887 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
While there are other sections of the forum devoted to this topic, I am doing this for those who may have questions directly for me, though general questions are also welcome. I also encourage anyone to come in and provide answers/discussion, as we can all learn from the knowledge pool here on the forum. This is just one way I am trying to reduce some of the load on my phone and email that makes it hard to get to all of my customers on a daily basis, especially when I am traveling.

The main systems we can discuss here are Motec, AEM and VPro but I am not opposed to questions regarding other systems.

You can also feel free to PM or email me!
 

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Cartographer
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2,887 Posts
Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
It is often asked how the main engine management systems out there for the Supra compare to each other, and also what advantages/disadvantages there are for each. Below is a brief outline, which is mostly my opinion based upon my experience with the systems and feedback I have gotten from end users. If you have any specific questions that aren't answered below, then feel free to post up or PM/Email.


AEM EMS: The AEM is probably the most popular standalone out there for the Supra, mostly due to being a very powerful system for a resonable price, all wrapped in a PNP package.
.....Strengths include: Great datalogging, excellent control of the factory items such as idle motors and automatic transmissions, awesome integrated boost control, good nitrous control and enough spare input/output to allow adding such things like methanol injection with failsafe, datalog a couple additional sensors and so on. The software is quite powerful, though some find it a bit overwhelming upon first use. All features are available to the end user.
.....Weaknesses would be some hardware quality issues that have come up, and some glitchy software/comms issues with various revisons of the software. I wish the software had a bit more in the way of user defined tables for the outputs and things like this. When using the factory igniter, the wasted spark output of the AEM reguires the use of ignition amplifiers even at relatively low boost.


HKS VPro: A high quality system from HKS, the VPro is also full plug and play like the AEM, and falls into a similar price category.
.....Strengths include: High quality hardware, works well with factory ignition system (does not require an amplifier at moderate boost levels), unique software tables/outputs which opens the option to keep the OEM ECU in place (and happy) to pass plug in emissions tests. It also has some additional software features that allow top notch tweaking of the driveability tuning and a very smooth running setup.
.....Weaknesses include: Datalogging that is adequate for the initial tune but not as great for data gathering/analysis (such as on a race car). Tuning/software is not available to the end user, and must be done by an HKS Pro Dealer. More geared for the tune it and forget it street crowd. Also does not have integrated boost control.

MoTeC: Top of the line engine management system, and we offer the PNP kit designed by Titan Motorsports, making for an easy install.
.....Strengths include: Hardware quality that is second to none and proven at some of the highest, most demanding levels of motorsport. Awesome datalogging/analysis, sofware power/flexibility, integrated boost control, nitrous control, traction control, etc. Many options available to configure the system to suit your needs, no matter what they are or your input/output demands. Works great with the factory igniter and just like the HKS VPro does not require an amplifier at modest boost levels. Uses USB comminications for fast, reliable connections on modern laptops. You can store up to 4 full, unique maps on the Motec, which are selectable via an optional switch or laptop. These are not trim maps like the AEM or VPro, but are complete maps. Perfect for those wanting to run drastically different fuels (pump gas, race gas, E85) and have full maps tailored to each available at the turn of a knob.
.....Weaknesses include: Price is higher than the other systems available. It cannot directly control the Toyota automatic transmission, and is not as well suited for the stepper idle control motor of the Supra. It can be tuned to work fine, just not quite as well setup for it as the AEM and uses up a lot of the available outputs.
 

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Registered
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6,435 Posts
John check your email :)

Has to do with the specifics of the auto tranny and the stepper motor ;)
 

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806 Posts
Very cool. I have a question about the AEM. My ac isnt working. I just had the charge checked today and it's good @ 120psi. I went through the setup/ac options and changed the ac clutch switch I believe it was to ls6 inverted and the ac came on cool but after a couple mins went warm air. Then I shut it off and turned it back on same thing. What should my options be set at? I have a 94 turbo mkiv. TIA,
Jon
 

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Supra OG
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2,392 Posts
So, if we want to make more power we should install one of these ECUs? What ECU would you recommend for my 91 toyota camry? I think it makes like 135 hp. Can any of the ECUs discussed get me into the 10's? :D
Thanks!
 

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Cartographer
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2,887 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Very cool. I have a question about the AEM. My ac isnt working. I just had the charge checked today and it's good @ 120psi. I went through the setup/ac options and changed the ac clutch switch I believe it was to ls6 inverted and the ac came on cool but after a couple mins went warm air. Then I shut it off and turned it back on same thing. What should my options be set at? I have a 94 turbo mkiv. TIA,
Jon

Here are what the settings should be:

 

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Cartographer
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2,887 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
So, if we want to make more power we should install one of these ECUs? What ECU would you recommend for my 91 toyota camry? I think it makes like 135 hp. Can any of the ECUs discussed get me into the 10's? :D
Thanks!
Well, Motec all the way. That is what I run in my MR2 that makes 135whp! :bigok:
 

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Supra OG
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2,392 Posts
A Motec ECU would go very well with my Motec exhaust. :D

Well, Motec all the way. That is what I run in my MR2 that makes 135whp! :bigok:
 

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707 Posts
Hi John,

someday we will have to meet. I've run aem since it first came out and am currently on v1.19b. My biggest annoyance has also been the time it takes after I start the car till when it will hold idle on it's own. Takes about 20 seconds of feathering the gas peddle from 1500 rpm slowly dropping to 750 rpm until what I think is the stepper motor kicks in and then you can hear it sucking air through the IAC valve and everything is ok. Is there anyway to decrease the time I need to hold the idle up for those 20 seconds? Would be a huge relief if you know of a fix.

Thanks,
Bill Perkins
 

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Supra OG
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2,392 Posts
John's setup for my AEM turns over nearly right away and I don't need to do anything special with the gas pedal.
 

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707 Posts
Mine turns over and starts quick, just takes about 15-20 seconds before it will idle on it's own which has always been annoying.
 

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806 Posts
Thanks for the ac settings John, I think mine is working now. You are a lifesaver. I really appreciate it.
Jon
 

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Go Getter!
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365 Posts
Great write, love the comparsion of the EMS and V-pro.

Regarding these two systems, which one normally takes longer/costs more to tune a MKIV?
 

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Supporting Vendor
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4,400 Posts
John,
What are your opinions on Autronic? Just curious to see what you think about it.

James
Autronic is a great system (all of their current boxes), I've always heard to it referred to as 80% of the Motec at 60% of the price...or something along those lines. They also supposedly have an excellent ignition system (like the CDI/8). Problem in my eyes lies in support. People would be surprised how much support there is for Motec around, and the network of users and tuners grows every day. People who even know what an Autronic is are few and far between. That said if you have a line on one with an experienced and qualified tuner by your side, I don't think you'll have any issues at all with it.

What would you use? An SM4?

That said, I'll let John respond, it's his thread. :)
 

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Cartographer
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2,887 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Hi John,

someday we will have to meet. I've run aem since it first came out and am currently on v1.19b. My biggest annoyance has also been the time it takes after I start the car till when it will hold idle on it's own. Takes about 20 seconds of feathering the gas peddle from 1500 rpm slowly dropping to 750 rpm until what I think is the stepper motor kicks in and then you can hear it sucking air through the IAC valve and everything is ok. Is there anyway to decrease the time I need to hold the idle up for those 20 seconds? Would be a huge relief if you know of a fix.

Thanks,
Bill Perkins
You can email me your map if you would like, and I can see if there is something simple I could help you with, without actually having my hands on the car.
 

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Cartographer
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Discussion Starter #19
Autronic is a great system (all of their current boxes), I've always heard to it referred to as 80% of the Motec at 60% of the price...or something along those lines. They also supposedly have an excellent ignition system (like the CDI/8). Problem in my eyes lies in support. People would be surprised how much support there is for Motec around, and the network of users and tuners grows every day. People who even know what an Autronic is are few and far between. That said if you have a line on one with an experienced and qualified tuner by your side, I don't think you'll have any issues at all with it.

What would you use? An SM4?

That said, I'll let John respond, it's his thread. :)
I could not have said it better myself Mark. If there are any particular features or comparisons between Autronic and the rest of the typical Supra systems you might like to discuss, post them up!

Two issues I have had with the Autronic SM4 (that I assume will get worked out in later revisions of the software/firmware), are the lack of knock control and some issues I have had with the boost control (which Autronic has sort of a work around for but it isn't quite the closed loop boost control you would expect from MoTeC or even AEM).

You are welcome in my thread anytime Mark! :)
 

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Newbe....I know nothing!
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Hello John,

Well I have herd great things from you and seen some of the cars you have done. Big thumbs up on having a thread like this, very good idea.

I do not really know were to start with my problems and I really do not know if this is the place to post them. Would it be better to e-mail you? really what eaver works for you.

My main goal is to get this sorted out enough to drive it down and get you to tune it. I really do not want to bring it down with a bag of issues sayign all it needs is a tune. I'm just lost with it right now.

Let me know if your intrested in taking on a mess lol

Thanks eather way :bigok:

Jeremy

p.s. its a 2jz MKIII with AEM
 
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