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Discussion Starter #1
For those of you that road race, if you were to get additional gauges, what would you get?

I'm currently looking at doing boost, water temp, oil temp and EGT.

Would your recommend oil pressure over oil temp?
The car is at BPU+ so relatively lightly modified.

BTW - if you have gauges installed in your car, please post pics!
I'd also appreciate rough numbers you've got for EGT, water temp, oil temp, oil pressure, etc for on track sessions.

Thanks,
-Darryl
 

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djo715 said:
For those of you that road race, if you were to get additional gauges, what would you get?

I'm currently looking at doing boost, water temp, oil temp and EGT.

Would your recommend oil pressure over oil temp?
The car is at BPU+ so relatively lightly modified.

BTW - if you have gauges installed in your car, please post pics!
I'd also appreciate rough numbers you've got for EGT, water temp, oil temp, oil pressure, etc for on track sessions.

Thanks,
-Darryl
Darryl,

I recommend at least the set of gauges I run: boost, EGT, and coolant temperature. I have these three installed in the A-pillar (boost is on top since it's the least often checked and the top gauge is somewhat in my peripheral vision, not direct view):



My EGT's peak around 660-680C on the road course. Coolant temps.. hmm.... mine seems to stabilize around 110C on a very hot day.. max I've seen is 115C. That's with FMIC, but a lot of cooling mods to try to make up for the FMIC. heh.

I can't really turn the boost below 1.1 - if I turn it down lower all I do is have slower spool but the same peak boost.. so I run about 16psi on the road course.

As for when (if) I ever go single.. I'm coinsidering adding 3 more gauges... A/F, fuel pressure, and oil temperature.

I wouldn't really worry about oil pressure on our motor.... it won't blow up from long sweeping corners like some V6's and V8's... ;)

Andi
 

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Andi:

Where do you have the sensors installed for each of your gauges? And, what's the best way to route the wiring harness for each?

I would like to get an A/F and EGT right away...

Do you have suggestions on EGT gauge and Wide band A/F gauge brands?

Thanks!
 

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Spool said:
Andi:

Where do you have the sensors installed for each of your gauges? And, what's the best way to route the wiring harness for each?

I would like to get an A/F and EGT right away...

Do you have suggestions on EGT gauge and Wide band A/F gauge brands?

Thanks!
The boost gauge sensor is tapped into the power steering vacuum line. It's got a sender bolted onto the driver's side inner fender, and the data link units for all 3 greddy gauges are ziptied above the steering column in the dashboard.

The EGT probe is at the top of the downpipe and its wires, in a stainless steel braided sleeve, are run all the way to the data link unit in the cabin.

The coolant temp gauge is tapped into the cast metal radiator pipe at the top left of the motor (connects to the big rubber water pipe that goes to the top of the radiator) -- tapped right next to where the stock gauge sender is. From there the wire goes straight to the data link unit in the car...

As for an A/F gauge, AFAIK there are no *true* wideband gauges that come in a round 60mm gauge format. The cheapest (that I know of) readily available true wideband o2 sensor is the one from FJO inc:

http://fjoinc.com/automotive/products.htm#wbo2

You can get it for $655 shipped through a group buy from Steve Hayes ([email protected]), who goes by Sixgun on this forum.

(The price on the FJO wbo2 is from memory.. I might be off by a few dollars....)

Andi
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Re: Re: Gauge Questions

Andi said:


Darryl,

I recommend at least the set of gauges I run: boost, EGT, and coolant temperature. I have these three installed in the A-pillar

My EGT's peak around 660-680C on the road course. Coolant temps.. hmm.... mine seems to stabilize around 110C on a very hot day.. max I've seen is 115C. That's with FMIC, but a lot of cooling mods to try to make up for the FMIC. heh.

As for when (if) I ever go single.. I'm coinsidering adding 3 more gauges... A/F, fuel pressure, and oil temperature.

Andi

Thanks for the reply Andi. I'm definitely doing those 3 - water temp, EGT and boost. The 4th gauge will prob be oil temp.
Eventually - I'd like to see if I can get a fuel pressure gauge as well as a A/F - but from your other post it sounds like a real A/F gauge might be pretty difficult to come by.

W/ respect to the numbers - Thanks - that will definitely help a lot. (except I've ordered gauges w/ the US units (Fahrenheit, psi, etc - so I'm gonna have to do some conversions... :) ) As to the coolant temps - I've added a HKS FMIC fairly recently, and have noticed temps of 2/3 - 3/4 of the stock gauge on a 100+ degree day. :eek: So changes I'm making now: Fluidyne radiator, Greddy Oil Cooler, and a vented hood. I'm hoping these changes will help to bring temps back down to normal!

If you do go single - where do you plan on mounting the other 3 gauges??? And how would you prioritize the view of those gauges? I'd think as a road racer - coolant temp is prob most important.

-Darryl


PS: Nice steering wheel. Forgot you had a 98. Hmmmm...
 
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As a related question, where would you mount extra gauges if you have a roll cage? The A-pillar is blocked by the front bar.
 

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Re: Re: Re: Gauge Questions

djo715 said:



Thanks for the reply Andi. I'm definitely doing those 3 - water temp, EGT and boost. The 4th gauge will prob be oil temp.
Eventually - I'd like to see if I can get a fuel pressure gauge as well as a A/F - but from your other post it sounds like a real A/F gauge might be pretty difficult to come by.

W/ respect to the numbers - Thanks - that will definitely help a lot. (except I've ordered gauges w/ the US units (Fahrenheit, psi, etc - so I'm gonna have to do some conversions... :) ) As to the coolant temps - I've added a HKS FMIC fairly recently, and have noticed temps of 2/3 - 3/4 of the stock gauge on a 100+ degree day. :eek:


Sounds about right. FYI, the stock gauge stays dead center from 85C to 103C. At 103C it starts moving slightly, and at 110C it's at 2/3. At 115C it's closer to 3/4.

So changes I'm making now: Fluidyne radiator, Greddy Oil Cooler, and a vented hood. I'm hoping these changes will help to bring temps back down to normal!
Have you seen my cooling tech article? I have what you mentioned and more, but not the vented hood:

http://www.boostaholic.com/supra/cooling/

Also I'm working on getting a MUCH better lower radiator air scoop made, one made out of 1/8" thick ABS plastic. That will happen in about 10 days..

If you do go single - where do you plan on mounting the other 3 gauges???
One option is this...

http://store5.yimg.com/I/supra_1652_22995903

Another is to install the two gauges on the left side of the dash, near where the mirror control is... and to install the wideband o2 digital readout on the steering column..

And how would you prioritize the view of those gauges? I'd think as a road racer - coolant temp is prob most important.
Coolant temp while you're on stock twins because it's the one that goes pretty damn high already.. once you've got a single turbo and coolant temp is stable, worry about oil temps. heh.

-Darryl


PS: Nice steering wheel. Forgot you had a 98. Hmmmm...
Thanks.. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Re: Re: Re: Re: Gauge Questions

Andi said:


Sounds about right. FYI, the stock gauge stays dead center from 85C to 103C. At 103C it starts moving slightly, and at 110C it's at 2/3. At 115C it's closer to 3/4.

Ah - thanks for the reference points on the stock gauge. Very useful until I get the water temp gauge installed.


Have you seen my cooling tech article? I have what you mentioned and more, but not the vented hood:

http://www.boostaholic.com/supra/cooling/

I have - I sent you pics of the trial hood - the one that has a lip so the air flowing over the hood would help pull the heat out of the engine compartment. (BTW - I couldn't see the pic where you mention manually turning on the stock electric fans on the driver's side of the radiator shroud by disconnecting the A/C pressure switch near the driver's side strut tower... )

I don't have the vented hood yet - (due in next month) but I certainly hope it helps. I definitely plan on implementing some of the other suggestions people have made in your article - i.e. no insulation under the hood - lighter and should help radiate more heat through the hood.


Also I'm working on getting a MUCH better lower radiator air scoop made, one made out of 1/8" thick ABS plastic. That will happen in about 10 days..
Hmmm - can you let me know how that works? I've got the HKS FMIC - I think that sits a bit lower than your Greddy... Nevertheless - it may be worth a shot. Do you find that the power steering fluid is really necessary? I've noticed even at autocrosses, most of the Japanese cars (300zx, Rx7, Supras, etc) all seem to have a little boilover on powersteering fluid...


One option is this...

http://store5.yimg.com/I/supra_1652_22995903

Another is to install the two gauges on the left side of the dash, near where the mirror control is... and to install the wideband o2 digital readout on the steering column..
I'm thinking about doing the gauges in the stock clock, Air vent, and temp control locations (ideally relocating heater controls to the left of the steering wheel, but otherwise in glove box).

Probably do water temp and boost in the 60mm gauges, and oil temp and egt in the small 46mm gauges. If I do get oil pressure/fuel pressure/AFM/etc later - perhaps that link you provided might work well - keeps all the gauges in one general direction...


Coolant temp while you're on stock twins because it's the one that goes pretty damn high already.. once you've got a single turbo and coolant temp is stable, worry about oil temps. heh.
Hmmm - single, huh? T04R? Have you done the research on singles for road racing already?

Thanks again Eric for the notes.

-Darryl
 

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Gauge Questions

T04r is an awful turbo for road racing.... just way too big IMHO. I'd get a T61 or max a T64. BB 0.7 on either one. On an HKS header with an HKS wastegate vented to atmosphere and you've built one helluva turbo kit. :) Oil cooled only and your water temps won't go up anymore.

Andi
 

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Andi, do you know when a T64 .7 spools up? Looks pretty nice for pump gas boost from the compressor map, actually spinning less RPMs at 18 psi than the T66. Problem is it isn't effecient above 18 psi, which doesn't bother me too much. But the T66 does spool pretty damn fast http://www.wotm.com/racing/94dyno.jpg

Not even I would try and road race with a T04R, unless you have an upped rev limiter.
 

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Grant said:
Andi, do you know when a T64 .7 spools up? Looks pretty nice for pump gas boost from the compressor map, actually spinning less RPMs at 18 psi than the T66. Problem is it isn't effecient above 18 psi, which doesn't bother me too much. But the T66 does spool pretty damn fast http://www.wotm.com/racing/94dyno.jpg

Not even I would try and road race with a T04R, unless you have an upped rev limiter.
Ryan's dyno that you posted is weird; it's very different from other T66 dyno's I've seen... It's almost as if Billy Barr's T66 spools a full 1000RPMs later? (I'd post the sheet but I can't find it on their website anymore.)

I don't know when a T64 BB .7 spools up, but I will soon.. a buddy of mine here in Dallas just got his T64 .7 BB (RPS based kit) put on and we will be tuning it this coming week.. we'll be sure to dyno at 14psi, 18psi, and 29psi.. :D

Andi
 

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Re: Re: Re: Gauge Questions

djo715 said:

I'd think as a road racer - coolant temp is prob most important.

Hey Darryl, I kinda disagree with this statement in its context. The coolant gauge will probably the least gauge that u would need, since the stock temperature gauge measure the coolant temperature as well. Why have 2?

Oil temperature and pressure are the most important thing imho. This is the blood of the engine. This what touches the cylinder heads, not the water. Thus really reflects directly on your engine temperature. Not to mention oil gets thinner as temperature raise. this will affect oil pressure as well. True that the way the oil pan design with small baffles will keep the oil from splashing and enable the pump to pick the oil up. But I've seen where the oil temperature gets so hot, and the pump fails to pick up sufficient oil to build the pressure since the oil is too thin. Granted this is not a supra, all engine in principal are the same, and oils have pretty much the same properties.

The oil temperature u want to keep around 190F give or take a little.

Andrie
 
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