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APU DCT Supra vs APU R34 vs Nismo GTR

 
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Yeah that is the issue with the Syvec and the stock Infineon TCU.. it bogs off the line which you can clearly hear on the 0-60 test. The other issue is that the the syvec and the MaxxECU only support (from last i checked..do not know the current, today status) the E9x SMG and not the DCT from the F series BMW which is where the power handling is really at.

The bad news is unless they are running at HTG in there.. no way to control the clutch slip.
HTG allows for F1 type clutch control (electronic). Can easily be a paddle or the OEM clutch with the correct electronics.
 

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Trying to learn as I follow along guys, as I never, ever contemplated switching out the Getrag 233. Does anyone know if the Getrag 7-speed DCT in the 2gen Ford GT is the same unit being discussed in this thread? Can this unit being discussed in this thread be built to hold 1,000 ft. lbs?

@figgie (and anyone else), in your opinion, is the MoTeC M-150 the best route to take to fully optimize the customer-spec'ed operating features, including docile around town behavior, the ability to launch HARD from a dig and to enhance the MKIV's already vaunted reputation for roll racing with, essentially, no boost loss shifts? TIA.


Ken.
 

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Ken,

Wade Hill has successfully installed a "built" Getrag 7 speed DCT on his MKIV Supra and recently ran 200+mph in the 1/2 mile this weekend in TX. I believe he is making 1300whp or so in his Supra. He is still experimenting with it, but the logs are pretty incredible, especially for high HP guys. No rebuilding boost between shifts, etc.

Steve
 

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If I am not mistaken Ken, the DCT gearbox in reference is the GS7D36SG. Its the 7 speed found in the F80 BMW M3 and F82/F84 BMW M4 and the F87 M2 . There is an earlier version but only a 6 speed. These are cheap as chips but you want the 7 speed DCT found in the above vehicles with the longer 0.671:1 top gear ratio, to get you to the 200+mph.

The gen 2 Ford GT DCT is the 7DCL750 which is also found in the AMG GT and SLS. Very expensive option to buy compared to the F8X series GS7D36SG.

I am going down this route myself as my body is riddled with arthritis and neck surgery is 2 weeks away.

I have and continue to run the Haltech Elite 2500 with the upgraded nexus software with this future conversion. It will do everything you are asking and more in combo with HTG ECU.

Rob
 

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BMW is phasing outs it’s DCT boxes (https://www.bmwblog.com/2021/01/11/goodbye-dual-clutch-transmission/) and is supposed to be going back to the original slush boxes like the one found in the Zupr4 - ZF 8HP - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_8HP_transmission

Ratios also play a big part in the ease of the swap which is why I am surprised at the lack of uptake on the AA80. Specifically from the Lexus ISF or their LS 460 with the sport package as that box uses the Sport Direct Shift (SPDS).

For anyone interested - In Detail: The Lexus IS F 8-Speed Sport Direct Shift Transmission - AutoSpies Auto News

The AA80 is also a direct fit. With NO “massaging“ of the trans tunnel with a hammer or cutting disc required and being Lexus means their 200mm ring and pinion should/will fit the smaller 200mm Supra diff.

@KenHenderson Either the MoTeC M150 or the Syvecs S7-Plus should be capable unless the HTG ECU does something they can’t.
 

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Trying to learn as I follow along guys, as I never, ever contemplated switching out the Getrag 233. Does anyone know if the Getrag 7-speed DCT in the 2gen Ford GT is the same unit being discussed in this thread? Can this unit being discussed in this thread be built to hold 1,000 ft. lbs?

@figgie (and anyone else), in your opinion, is the MoTeC M-150 the best route to take to fully optimize the customer-spec'ed operating features, including docile around town behavior, the ability to launch HARD from a dig and to enhance the MKIV's already vaunted reputation for roll racing with, essentially, no boost loss shifts? TIA.


Ken.
If i recall corectly, the Ford GT DCT (along with the Prancing Ponies and C8 vette) are all transaxle based DCT. That would require rengineering the entire rear subframe and possibly the rear end of the car to make happen. The only Engine Mounted DCT that I am aware of are the BMW F series (M3/4, M5) and the OLDER SMG based E9x transmissions.

Currently the ONLY system that has complete and unfettered control of the DCT is the HTG GCU. The HTG GCU requires that the OEM TCU be completely removed from the DCT (punch and hammer, it comes out only in pieces and not a complete subassembly).

OEM BMW DCT TCU
Circuit component Passive circuit component Hardware programmer Engineering Font


Should look like this after you are done

Asphalt Road surface Pollution Tar Plastic



Then replace with this and it is a nice tidy solution.

White Motor vehicle Hood Light Grille


MoTeC currently does not as the DCT Require at least 10 powered output to control solenoids which would require custom firmware (read development license) and the M190/M18x series. Those are the only ones that have the needed outputs.

Maxxecu and Syvec use the OEM TCU to do the control by replicating ALL the BMW Canbus messages that the OEM TCU requires which means that you are always within the OEM TCU limits regardless of "trickery" done to get higher pressure for clutches, shifting etc.
 
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If i recall corectly, the Ford GT DCT (along with the Prancing Ponies and C8 vette) are all transaxle based DCT. That would require rengineering the entire rear subframe and possibly the rear end of the car to make happen. The only Engine Mounted DCT that I am aware of are the BMW F series (M3/4, M5) and the OLDER SMG based E9x transmissions.

Currently the ONLY system that has complete and unfettered control of the DCT is the HTG GCU. MoTeC does not as the DCT Require at least 10 powered output to control solenoids which would require custom firmware (read development license) and the M190/M18x series

Maxxecu and Syvec use the OEM TCU to do the control by replicating ALL the BMW Canbus messages that the OEM TCU requires.
Haltech 2500 has 12 outputs that are programmable and 45 programmable channels of canbus and I spoke to them at FL2K and they said it can run the gearbox due to it has a shift controller and torque management built into it. HT-151305 Elite 2500 + Premium Universal Wire-in Harness Kit - Haltech
 

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Haltech 2500 has 12 outputs that are programmable and 45 programmable channels of canbus and I spoke to them at FL2K and they said it can run the gearbox due to it has a shift controller and torque management built into it. HT-151305 Elite 2500 + Premium Universal Wire-in Harness Kit - Haltech
Ask them about the Amperage limit on each of those outputs. what has been an issue is that each DCT solenoid requires 10 Amps/solenoid with peaks of 20 amps of inrush current which usually makes standalones a none starter. THen of course the custom development for that... In the MoTeC i can develop that on my own if needed but not sure about any other standalone.

Also on the outputs... remember that if running DCT, you definelty need a DBW which removes 2 powered outputs... hopefully nothing else like e-fans or fuel pump control is being used.

Once the TCU is removed, there is no need for CANbus except to keep wiring clean and if you need to display things like gear

IE HTG can run with just RPM Input, TPS input and MAP for load calc.
 

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If i recall corectly, the Ford GT DCT (along with the Prancing Ponies and C8 vette) are all transaxle based DCT. That would require rengineering the entire rear subframe and possibly the rear end of the car to make happen. The only Engine Mounted DCT that I am aware of are the BMW F series (M3/4, M5) and the OLDER SMG based E9x transmissions.

Currently the ONLY system that has complete and unfettered control of the DCT is the HTG GCU. The HTG GCU requires that the OEM TCU be completely removed from the DCT (punch and hammer, it comes out only in pieces and not a complete subassembly).

OEM BMW DCT TCU
View attachment 265820

Should look like this after you are done

View attachment 265821


Then replace with this and it is a nice tidy solution.

View attachment 265818

MoTeC currently does not as the DCT Require at least 10 powered output to control solenoids which would require custom firmware (read development license) and the M190/M18x series. Those are the only ones that have the needed outputs.

Maxxecu and Syvec use the OEM TCU to do the control by replicating ALL the BMW Canbus messages that the OEM TCU requires which means that you are always within the OEM TCU limits regardless of "trickery" done to get higher pressure for clutches, shifting etc.
Wow, that is really clever stuff, thanks for sharing. Would there be any benefit to using something like this on a built OEM A340 or is this for more modern boxes like the Lexus AA80E and BMW/Ford DCT boxes?
 

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Wow, that is really clever stuff, thanks for sharing. Would there be any benefit to using something like this on a built OEM A340 or is this for more modern boxes like the Lexus AA80E and BMW/Ford DCT boxes?
Ok that is for a different thread...

I know MoTeC (and specifically John Reed) just relelased a A340 package that does have complete control of the A340.. Real street posted video of it.
 
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