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Would you be interested in a Group A Replica pan?

  • Yes defiantly, where do I sign

    Votes: 28 39.4%
  • Depends on the cost

    Votes: 38 53.5%
  • No

    Votes: 5 7.0%

  • Total voters
    71
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Discussion Starter #1
I've got almost everything I need to make cast aluminum, I'm just researching the casting aspect of it right now.

This poll is to see how many people would be seriously interested in a Group A replica out of aluminum and 18 guage sheet metal.

This is Jakes unit that he restored, and hopefully I can get his help with the casting aspect if it gets to that point!

http://www.gaslightautomotive.com/turboa.htm

From what I can tell the approximate price for each pan will be about $300 to $500 USD before shipping. It is really to early to tell exactly.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
NegativeGeForce said:
More oil in the pan, run a higher oil pressure w/o starving the pickup?
basically that what I understand it as.

not to mention the intimidation factor :D
 

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I may be, depending on when they come available (if it's during summer, when school's out, I have much more spendable cash :) )
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I'm doing all the research for them now... going to find out the cost of getting a mold, or just getting them cast somewhere else... I'm going to go with the most cost effective route... then fabicate the sheet metal components, then get them anodized or whatever... then ship them to the buyer...

I'll know better in a week or two what they'll cost, then from there I'll know when they'll be going into production if the number of units wanted outweights the initial cost of production.
 

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i want one. would buy today if you had one available.

would you also offer a longer pickup, as i understand it, our stock pickup is a wee bit short.
 

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Be original, not a copy
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The pickup realy is not needed if you get decent baffling. I did lengthen the pickup on the 7M's pump and it was a LOT of work to make sure there were no suction leaks.

The Group A pan allows for about a quart more oil and a "flatter" pan (so that there is more oil over a larger area which provides a good deal more reserve oil). A lot of oil likes to sit up on top of the head--especially in high rpms with high oil pressure. The three drainbacks from the head (not including the hose on the side of the ds cam cover) are not really large enough to get the oil back down to the pan quickly. I always run 1/2 quart over the full mark even with the lengthened pickup. This gives adequate reserve so that the oil has time to return to the sump and prevent cavitation (oil starvation). Plus, if you are turning hard the pickup can be uncovered with the stock pan which could cause a few SECONDS of oil pressure loss. First no oil, then the pump would have to re-prime. That would be enough time to do MAJOR damage to the motor.

I would be astounded if you can get a pan cast for $300---because of the way the pan is shaped you would have to have it injection or vacuum molded (pressure mold). Probably one of the "cheapest" ways to improve the oil pan would be to simply weld some "wings" on the sides of the stock pan to make the floor of the pan have more area.
 

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you'll never have that thing cast. it's way to cost prohibitive. you'll never get enough people to buy in to get the price decent enough to where it's reasonable. you'd have to have a few hundred people interested in order to make casting worth while. It's a high buy in low production cost method. Doesn;t work for low quantities.


Anyway, welded up sheetmetal ones are a much better bet. I've got to get some pics of mine as this has come up a few times lately. It'd pretty damn easy to cut up a pan and weld on a new larger sump. You will want a larger pickup though. I was looking at one made for a c5 corvette, something like that might work well. you'd just have to braze the new pickup onto the old tube. I haven't done that part yet. Anyone else have any ideas for a better pickup, I'm interested.
 

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Weld the extra cutouts, pay a couple of hundred for an accumulator to deal with any short term oil starvation issues. Street going cars won't need any more than that. Next best thing to dry sump, which is really the big daddy for curing all possible oiling system issues, but will knock you back a 1-1.5k all in...
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I can build an EXACT duplicate in all sheet metal... but I make my pans out of 16 gauge for strenth, which would add weight to the already heavy mkiii.

If someone wants one of these pans in just sheetmetal, I can defaintly do that. It would take about 2 days for me to build (all hand built).

I am looking into the options for cast, I might have an injection mold made and go the route of investment molding. I have the equipment to cast aluminum up at my shop... just not the mold.

So if someone does for sure want one of these pans in straight sheet metal... let me know.
 

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Beats and Rhythm
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You can buy a moroso baffle kit for like $200 bucks or somewhere in that price range.

This would be a great asset for those who still tune the 7m

I didnt know the turbo A had a different oil pan:eek:
 

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If you are a really talented wood worker and can make the patterns and core boxes you might be able to pull it off in the sub $1000 range. You got to figure a mold shop is probably gonna want about $5k+ to do the patterns and core boxes. Doing the actual castings itself is the cheap part. Then you have to heat treat, machine it, finish it, etc. Sheet metal would be by far the cheapest way for the small #s you'll make. The weight difference between a sheet steel one and a cast AL is probably going to be small. You can always machine an AL flange and use AL sheet for the rest as well.
 

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""I didnt know the turbo A had a different oil pan""

They didn't. The 500 street Turbo A's came with the stock oil pan. They are talking about the Group A racing spec oil pan.
 
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hmm.. for the 300-500$ of that pan, I could buy a dry sump pump... which is over half the cost of a dry sump system..

It's an interesting idea, for sure, to have some of the early supra racing history. But it comes down to your motivations. Are you in this to add historical parts? Or are you spending this money to make your car more compedative?

Will
 

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87MA70Turbo said:
hmm.. for the 300-500$ of that pan, I could buy a dry sump pump... which is over half the cost of a dry sump system..

It's an interesting idea, for sure, to have some of the early supra racing history. But it comes down to your motivations. Are you in this to add historical parts? Or are you spending this money to make your car more compedative?

Will
yes.. that is just the pump. Especially with a 3 stage and you can almost rule out 4 stage dry sumps. That DOES NOT include the plumbing which is as much if not more than the dry sump pump. Then you need to plumb the engine accordingly. Then you need the custom oil pan ANYWAY for the dry sump setup. Then you need to mount all this correctly. By the time it is all said and done. 1k - 1.5k easily if not more on a dry sump setup.
 

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87MA70Turbo said:
hmm.. for the 300-500$ of that pan, I could buy a dry sump pump... which is over half the cost of a dry sump system..

It's an interesting idea, for sure, to have some of the early supra racing history. But it comes down to your motivations. Are you in this to add historical parts? Or are you spending this money to make your car more compedative?

Will
Too make the car more competitive. Putting the looks of the pan aside. The most important part of the pan is the baffling in the pan. Toyota came up with a way to fix the oil starvation the 7M sees on hard cornering. That is the whole purpose of this pan. Adding the extra oil capacity is secondary. I am not even going to say how much I have into the engine in the car now much less the engine that is being put together. 1500.00 dollars of insurance is nothing.

Jake
 

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I'm desperately trying to figure out why Kamikaze pilots wore helmets.


cause they didn't always die kamikaze style, plus it wasn't a helmet as much as a fur lined hat to keep their ears and head warm... at elevation...


what are you doing, jake... just 1 j it... :D j/k
so when is it going to be ready...

in regards to the pan, for 300 that is cheap insurance...
 

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i highly doubt you are going to be able to make a pan for between 3 and 500 dollars. For one thing, when designing the mould, MANY things must be accounted for including complexity of the casting, solidification shrinkage, etc. For what its worth, it would be much more cost effective to make one-off sheet metal pans. Despite what people say right now, i find it hard to beleive there will be enough demand to warrant going through the trouble of casting these.

adam
 

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Navy Cuda, the best option here is to get a fabricator like Moroso to copy that cast pan in aluminum sheetmetal with a nice flange.
If they could kick a copy out with the baffles and other details of that pan in the sub 300.00 range, I'd buy one tomarrow.

If anyone else wants to fab a pan up from aluminum that is a copy of that pan I would buy one tomarrow for that same price. Even a modified stock one with the same features/baffles would be worth 200ish. (I'd provide the core if you want too.)
 
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