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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have noticed that a lot of Supra owners use Innovative turbochargers, the Honda world is dominated by Precision(www.precisionte.com).... I think mainly because of the price. After researching available turbos from both companies it seems that Innovative is the spare no expense approach (all turbos have INCONEL wheels!), and the Precision is bang for the buck!

Is the lower price of Precision turbos reflective of lower quality, less R&D, or the fact that they use Garret CHRA's instead of making their own? Or all of the above?

Also, I believe it is not a coincidence that Honda owners use Precision, they are a little cheaper, and the Supra guys use Innovative turbochargers, is it because Innovative markets towards you Supra owners or because Innovative snails really are better? What do you guys that have Innovative turbos or Precision turbos think about your turbos in comparison to others?
 
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I see owners everywhere using different turbo manufacturers. PTE has been pushing hard to get into the import scene, evidenced by their custom castings etc. Innovative does some custom wheels and so forth, and has their own following as well. Rick Head was with Turbonetics for years and knows his stuff, Harry at PTE worked for Garret for years before he was at PTE. Both have their opinions and custom setups, I see people going fast with many different makes of turbos.

PTE doesn't use any of the aftermarket ball bearing setups, and is only recently doing Garret ball bearing setups. Innovative has been doing their own ball bearing setups for a while.

You have to remember that any 3rd party, aftermarket place will never do the R&D work that an OEM supplier, such as Garret/KKK/Borg-Warner would do. So any custom housing or custom wheel made by PTE/Innovative won't have the benefit of that work. Not saying they aren't well thought pieces, just something to consider.

IMO, they are of comparable quality, and you'll hear stories from people on all sides saying good, bad, etc. I do know that PTE works closely with distributors/shops to find the combinations that are popular and customized for certain applications.

Long rant, but long story short, I don't think there is any magic turbo. I've ran many different turbos for many different buildups over the years. The biggest problems you'll see will either be attributed to either

a) a poorly built turbo, or one with serious problems of some sort (clearancing way off, imbalanced turbo, crappy machining)

b) turbo size issues (way too big, or way too small) resulting in poor performance somehow

Since I am not rich, nor sponsored, I refuse to use any turbo that is over the top expensive, since it may need rebuilding or replacement the next season, or heck, the next week.
 

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There are just as many (if not more) supra's running precision turbos as there are running innovative turbos. It's a big debate that seems to never end. Here's how I see it...

Innovative took the Garret technology to the next level... came up with their own dual ball bearing centers, lighter materials, etc.
Basically I think they modified the Garret turbo design to make a better series of turbos.

Now Garret has come out with all new GT series of turbos, completely different from the old T series.

Now if Innovative was just upgrading the T series to make a better turbo, but now the GT series is out... which is better... the upgraded T series that Innovative uses, or the new GT series? That's the debate.

Now I've heard that Innovative recently switched to BorgWarner wheel design. Can anyone confirm this?
 

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Innovative uses turbos sourced through BorgWarner and its european affiliates (triple k, schwitzer, etc.)... this distribution channel adds cost to the product line vs. what Precision is using, especially when it comes to the larger turbos... i haven't heard anything bad about Innovative turbos (other than cost) but i can tell you that you will not be disappointed with a Precision Turbo... there are WAY more precision turbos on supras than innovative turbos... they are not a "cheap" product at all...
 

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I was told by someone at Precision that they make the custom castings for SP turbos. Precision does good work, their turbos usually perform really well. If they come out with something that does not perform up to par, it is pulled off the market. I would still rather have a full Garret GT setup than just about anything else, but that's just me and my obsessive self...
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Smeagol-

I agree about the amount of research and development that can only be funded by the main manufacturers (kkk, garrett, borg-warner) but that R&D is dedicated to different features than we look for as performance minded people. The main manufacturers are worried about their contracts with the OEM's, NOT the small amount of turbos that they will sell to the aftermarket. Think about it, the OEM contracts for a factory turbo guarantee that they will sell 10,000 or MORE turbos. These turbos must have a failure rate of less than 5% for them to even be considered by the OEM's (as I was told from Terry @ Innovative).

So this R&D is applied to long term reliability and other things that may not be applicable to aftermarket performance turbochargers.

ALSO: What about Ball Bearing center sections vs. a 360 thrust bearing. Actual experiences.
 

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Ooohhhhhh another one of these threads again :D

IMO I have not seen anything that says ITS are any better than Precision for the difference in price.......if someone could provide some concrete proof of what makes the ITS so much better......
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Innovative uses inconel in ALL of their turbine wheels! This means anti-lag won't be as harmful to your turbine because the inconel can handle much higher egt's. Little things like this, combined with the fact that they have created their own ball bearing CHRA's based on their experience at Turbonetics is why I am so impressed with them.

I am very interested to hear more about Precision turbo's vs. Innovative and Ball Bearing vs. thrust. Innovative impressed me very much when talking to them on the phone, but I am looking for the absolute best turbo for the application and it should be public information about who that manufacturer is.
 
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