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Silver Bullet said:
cummins...Yes i had the oil restrictor on all of them on the feed. That way it was spray pattern vs a flooding of oil. And Yep...trust me we could not believe it either when we first put the SP77 on. It outspooled the ITS 76R DBB by a ton...and out spooled the ITS 74 DBB by a little....but made much more power. Its the best turbo i have had..and dont see changing it anytime soon. Since i am only running 30-33 psi and its capable of much more if i ever decide to change setup in any way. PHR 2+ was the 2nd best one i have had...that thing on a 75 shot was insane. ....lol

Tony
WOW, I sure hope my turbo doesn't take a shit on me soon. The R wheel isn't good for our cars we just dont' have the displacement. That 76R is not a good combo for us. They do have a new X wheel though. But I don't know anyone that has tried it.

Are you running the .81 a/r with your sp77? When do you see full boost? Thanks in advance.
 

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Well in the past the ITS turbos did leak and they had problems with them. They have fixed that problem from what I was told by an external source.
You can run them with or without water. The water just adds the extra cooling for the bearings.
The DBB does show a difference in spool and ITS uses a dual ceramic BB center section. Turbonetics used a single BB setup.
I cannot speak on the Garrett turbos. Silvino is a perfect example of a BB turbo and has one of the best dyno graphs out there.
Most here may be biased in turbos since the majority of the supra community purchases the precision based turbos since they are cheaper, but who knows if the parts are cheaper compared to an ITS or vise versa.
I know the ITS turbos come with the inconel exhaust wheel which is better for higher temps.
Maybe PHR can tune in here. I remember OBIWAN telling me they used ITS in some applications.
Just some info.
 

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Silver Bullet said:

And yes you read correctly....the 77HO outspooled my ITS 74Q and 76R DBB turbos.
Please explain how you documented this :) I've seen logs of a 74dbb Q trim and they out spooled my 74gts by a good 150 rpms. Surely it would out spool a 76gts??? Are you saying that you see 18psi by 4100 rpm's?:eek:
 

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KenHenderson said:
I don't know about ITS but HKS DBB turbos can be run with and without water cooling. Some of the very first 2540s and 2835s HKS released did not even have an accommodation for water cooling. Although most of the HKS twin DBB turbos are water and oil cooled, my GT3240s are oil cooled only and I believe this is the case with the T51-R SPL DBB.

Ken.
Good info, Ken. FWIW, all of the TRUE Garrett BB GT turbos come with water cooling... GT25R, GT28R, GT28RS, GT30R, GT3071R, GT35R, GT42R.
 

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chidoks said:
bump for more info.. i was looking into an its 74mm dbb... Anyone else offer a similar sized ball bearing turbo?
Garrett GT42R 53-Trim
 

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I know of several 6 speeds that see full boost at 4300 with the ITS 74Q dbb. I'm also curious as to where you saw full boost with yours and where you see it with your 77ho. I know the ITS 76R is laggy but I didn't think 74Q was laggy also, at least not laggier than a precison 76S.
 

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Full boost at 4300RPMs on a 74mm turbo?! Umm, I'm going to have to see a log of this before I believe it. I have a 71mm turbo that spools at 4600RPMs so a 74 spooling this low is a bit incredible. Log it, do a 4th gear pull from 1500RPMs up until full spool. If this turbo is THAT fast I might buy one :eek:
 

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cummins said:
To all those that have had their ITS DBB fail, have you ran the oil restrictor? I know that recent dbb turbos have them built in but from what I understand there needs to be an oil restrictor on the feed. I have a 74 dbb and without the restrictor the turbo leaked oil. With it the turbo seems fine.

Silverbullet, its hard to belive that your sp77 outspools the 74 that is amazing. What a/r you running on the 77?
ITS now has the oil restrictor built into their DBB center section.
As for the R wheel. Definitely a laggier wheel than the S wheel so you cannot even compare, but it does provide more top end power.
The X wheel they make is supposed to compete with the S wheel. The X is smaller but said to be more efficient. I dont have proof of that, just relaying what i've read and know.

DBB is supposed to yield a 500rpm quicker spool.

In another month i'll definitely be posting up my chart to compare my DBB vs a non.
 

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BLKMGK said:
Full boost at 4300RPMs on a 74mm turbo?! Umm, I'm going to have to see a log of this before I believe it. I have a 71mm turbo that spools at 4600RPMs so a 74 spooling this low is a bit incredible. Log it, do a 4th gear pull from 1500RPMs up until full spool. If this turbo is THAT fast I might buy one :eek:
Try asking Sal P, he's one of the people that said he reaches full boost at 4300. And ask Ryan he said something similar. Both with the 74 dbb. I can't do it in 4th gear I only have 3.
:p
 

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cummins said:
Try asking Sal P, he's one of the people that said he reaches full boost at 4300. And ask Ryan he said something similar. Both with the 74 dbb. I can't do it in 4th gear I only have 3.
:p
I'll talk to Ryan but he knows as well as anyone that I won't believe something like that without a log that I can overlay with the dozen others I have. An auto with a stall I can believe more easily but on a six speed that's a feat!
 

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BLKMGK said:
I'll talk to Ryan but he knows as well as anyone that I won't believe something like that without a log that I can overlay with the dozen others I have. An auto with a stall I can believe more easily but on a six speed that's a feat!
I can see making full street boost at 4200-4300 (18psi), BUT not 30psi. FYI- MY SP74GTS made 18psi by 4380. There's no way a 76gts is going to out spool that or a DBB for that matter. Just my 2 psi
 

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How exactly are people judging spool? Can you really tell how fast a turbo spools by looking at a dyno graph?
 

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talltrini10 said:
How exactly are people judging spool? Can you really tell how fast a turbo spools by looking at a dyno graph?
IMO? NO WAY! I have logs of two turbos thatshow one spooling 400RPMs before the other (my car). If I overlay the dyno sheets you cannot tell that one outspooled the other like that. One makes more power for sure but you cannot really see where the spool occured IMO. Unfortunatly I've had almost NO luck putting the graph up on this forum due to the $&^$ danged attachment mechanism. It's posted on the AEM forum as of last night...
 

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BLKMGK said:
An auto with a stall I can believe more easily but on a six speed that's a feat!

Wouldn't the higher the stall, the laggier it would be since there is less load or does load have no impact on spool?

While I did do some other work that could have impacted this, when I went from a 3600-3800 stall to a 3200 stall, I see positive boost sooner with the lower stall?

Brad
 

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banton said:
Wouldn't the higher the stall, the laggier it would be since there is less load or does load have no impact on spool?

While I did do some other work that could have impacted this, when I went from a 3600-3800 stall to a 3200 stall, I see positive boost sooner with the lower stall?

Brad
I've not got alot of experience with autos, I'll say that up front. However I tuned a TH400 equipped car for a friend of mine that had a decent sized turbo - 74mm or so I think. Driving down the road at a cruise if I smacked the gas the RPMs jumped up, the stall flashed, and we had instant boost. It was pretty fun too let me tell you except thatcreeping in parking lots sucked. He had a stall up over 4K I think - I'll need to ask him.

Anyway, from that single experience I believe that stall effects spool. It's obviously not alot of experience and it wasn't logged (boo!) but stall did make a difference I think. I'll admit I don't know how the car would've spooled with a lower stall so you may very well be right, maybe the way it revved so quick helped?

I suppose my comment really ought to read "What stall" and not assume it was a high stall because you could very well be right that lower equals faster spool. I just have a hard time believing that a turbo 3mm bigger than mine spools hundreds of RPMs more quickly - there has to be more to the story than the turbo. <shrug>
 

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I see what you are saying BLKMGK. To be honest, while my car seems to initiate boost sooner with the lower stall, I can't tell if full boost is hit any earlier. Even so, if I am correct, I would guess that would translate into more power under the curve even it full boost isn't achieved sooner.

BTW, I hope to log some runs on my AEM in the next couple of weeks (once the WB is hooked-up) and will send them to you for comparison with other 67mm logs you may have.

Brad

EDIT: Sorry, back to the DBB topic:D
 

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i have an ITS 61mm .70 a/r almost 1.5 years over 8000 miles and i make 508hp on pump gas and have made as much as 513 at 17.5lbs on 94 octane...very happy with its and the service they give me i talk to my salesman pretty regularly to this day.
 
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