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Master Of The Obvious
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437 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
IMO the new Supra is trash, it’s a BMW in a Toyota dealership and we all know the specs and how much we hate the design and so on. I found this on Instagram and I thought WOW, why couldn’t this had been the new Supra?!?!

FE5D4098-1FB4-4C7D-B5CA-1733AE454AB4.jpeg

I would love to know the opinions in the community of Supra lovers and owners. Should this have been the next edition?! 👍🏻
 

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I care about the looks because its not even a close match to the original FT-1 concept. It's funny, everyone is expecting me to get the new supra because of my involvement with the MKIV. My wife, who is a big BMW fan and drives one currently, doesnt even like the new Supra and hates the fact that its mostly BMW!!! All the elements we both loved about the MKIV are non existent in the MKV.
 

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Looks like the same car, only changes seem to be headlights/bumper/wing for a more MKIV feel.

Im not sure what I would've expected, FT1 concept cues wouldve been a nice start. It should've strived to be a halo car, a car that pushed some benchmarks like the MKIV did. It should've lived up to the Supra name "above or beyond". It should've been a Toyota.

Instead Toyota copped out, and hopefully the community along with other consumers started hitting them with that message. Given how Toyota is starting to communicate more than they ever have with us. Im assuming they realize that they fucked up. I hope they take steps to make it a real Supra, but Im sure theyre trying to propaganda this with damage control.
 

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Master Of The Obvious
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Discussion Starter #5
I agree with all of you, and yes the photo I posted just has more of an update MK4 feel to the new body style, but I am just shocked with how amazing the 2JZ is and was, they just steered away from the greatness. It’s a shame and when I walked into the dealership to see the new “Supra” I was sad and literally upset at everything I saw and I will not spend 80,000 dollars on that BS. I will buy a used MK4 or a MK3 again before I spend my hard earned money on that BMW
 

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JetFire
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5,277 Posts
^^^They aren't $80K either way while I don't hate this car as much as others I get the disappointment. Toyota is the #1 Auto Manufacturer in the world and made $200 billion in revenue last year and is more than capable of doing an in house setup from our view but they chose other wise.
 

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I Can Has EBT?
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3,245 Posts
I kind of prefer the current Zupra look over that rendering. The car itself does not look all that bad on outside, rest of it is BMW garbage.
 

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Administrator
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What I dont understand are the Toyota apologists on here coming to defend Toyota saying it didnt make sense for them to develop it in house, the cost, the lfa was an expensive mistake, etc. Like, did you sit in on those meetings? No you didnt, shut the fuck up.
 

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The best answer to the incomplete sentence that is the thread title is:
"New Supra should have been.......a Toyota! 🤬
No argument. They didn't and there is a reason why. We just don't know what it was. Oh, BTW, contrary to FasTTurbo's assertion, I'm not an apologist, I just like playing devils advocate. That said, I'm guessing it was all about money. Of course they could have simply re-skinned the RC-F in Supra shaped body panels, cheapened the interior to keep cost down then slapped a Supra badge on it. Solved, one Toyota sourced 2020 Supra. Having the Supra built on a Lexus shared chassis with shared components (engine, suspension, etc) is not exactly a new concept for Toyota (MKIV, SC300, SC400) for Toyota. This Toyota sourced Supra would have more power (V8 at 472 hp, +140 hp vs Zupr4), be more reliable (vs BMW), pull less on the skidpad, be slower to 60 mpg (4.2 sec), equal in the quarter mile and slower on the track. But since it would now be built by Toyota, I'm sure everybody on here would be happy. A question everyone (anti-Zupr4 ers and apologists) should be asking is: if Toyota is really capable of building a world beater sports car at this price point (~$60K) that is also profitable, why is it that the RC-F is not competitive? Even better, why is it that despite the RC-F track edition being special built by Lexus (50 units for US) for the track, lightened by 121 lbs, sporting carbon-ceramic brakes, having a 477 hp V8 and costing $100K, the Zupr4 still outperforms it on the track? Car and Drive 2020 Lightening Lap shows 3:01.4 Zupr4 vs 3:02.6 for the RC-F Track Edition. Just saying!!!! Oh and BTW, I'd take the RC-F track edition over the Zupr4 any day, despite it being slower. Nicer car.
 

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Hardcore Night Warrior
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Oh, BTW, contrary to FasTTurbo's A question everyone (anti-Zupr4 ers and apologists) should be asking is: if Toyota is really capable of building a world beater sports car at this price point (~$60K) that is also profitable,

If Chevrolet can do it, then I don't see why Toyota with all it's resources can't figure it out themselves. On top of that, it's at a higher tier of performance than the price point the Zupra is at.
 

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Once again, I don't disagree. Sounds simple. So why doesn't the RC-F Track Edition outperform the 2020 Corvette? Lexus even had $40K of extra revenue to play with. Hard to figure!!!
 

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Very Senior Member
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No argument. They didn't and there is a reason why. We just don't know what it was. Oh, BTW, contrary to FasTTurbo's assertion, I'm not an apologist, I just like playing devils advocate. That said, I'm guessing it was all about money. Of course they could have simply re-skinned the RC-F in Supra shaped body panels, cheapened the interior to keep cost down then slapped a Supra badge on it. Solved, one Toyota sourced 2020 Supra. Having the Supra built on a Lexus shared chassis with shared components (engine, suspension, etc) is not exactly a new concept for Toyota (MKIV, SC300, SC400) for Toyota. This Toyota sourced Supra would have more power (V8 at 472 hp, +140 hp vs Zupr4), be more reliable (vs BMW), pull less on the skidpad, be slower to 60 mpg (4.2 sec), equal in the quarter mile and slower on the track. But since it would now be built by Toyota, I'm sure everybody on here would be happy. A question everyone (anti-Zupr4 ers and apologists) should be asking is: if Toyota is really capable of building a world beater sports car at this price point (~$60K) that is also profitable, why is it that the RC-F is not competitive? Even better, why is it that despite the RC-F track edition being special built by Lexus (50 units for US) for the track, lightened by 121 lbs, sporting carbon-ceramic brakes, having a 477 hp V8 and costing $100K, the Zupr4 still outperforms it on the track? Car and Drive 2020 Lightening Lap shows 3:01.4 Zupr4 vs 3:02.6 for the RC-F Track Edition. Just saying!!!! Oh and BTW, I'd take the RC-F track edition over the Zupr4 any day, despite it being slower. Nicer car.
TL: Dull read
More what-ifs solve nothing and comparing non-existent cars is silly. Toyota built the MKIV without Lexus and they could have done it right with a totally new machine.
Toyota could easily have afforded to build the Supra as a halo car and lose money directly - but gain overall. They did not and the result sucks - plain and simple.
 

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Hardcore Night Warrior
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Once again, I don't disagree. Sounds simple. So why doesn't the RC-F Track Edition outperform the 2020 Corvette? Lexus even had $40K of extra revenue to play with. Hard to figure!!!
Near 3800 lbs, has less hp, and much less torque, Not hard to figure.
 

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TL: Dull read
More what-ifs solve nothing and comparing non-existent cars is silly. Toyota built the MKIV without Lexus and they could have done it right with a totally new machine.
Toyota could easily have afforded to build the Supra as a halo car and lose money directly - but gain overall. They did not and the result sucks - plain and simple.
I'm not trying to solve any problems. But since you're asking, what problems have you solved vis-a-vis this topic? Is it the need for the witty remarks you provide to inform the last seven guys on the planet who don't know; 'the car is a BMW not a Supra", or "It's just a hard top BMW Z4", or "It's called Zupr4 not Supra", or "it's not an A90", or "it's supposed to be Toyota's halo car"? Or maybe, it's providing Toyota management the benefit of your superior financial analysis capabilities or general business acumen? With annual revenues of $272.0B, a market cap of $195.8B and net income of $16.9B, Toyota obviously needs your help. Conversely GM with substantially lower annual revenues of $147.0B (at one time, it was the worlds largest car company), a market cap of $54.2B (27% of Toyota) and net income of $7.9B has it all figured out. I guess Toyota could have built a new Supra themselves, lost money (or not) and the worlds problems would have been solved!!! Or maybe, it's just incredibly naive for anyone who is not on Toyota's management team to second guess them on; the company's future direction, investment of its development budget, what cars will provide the highest forward looking ROI (return on investment) and how to best maximize shareholder value. Just saying!!!
 

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Near 3800 lbs, has less hp, and much less torque, Not hard to figure.
Agreed! "Hard to figure" was just sarcasm. So why didn't they simply build the RC-F (or RC-F track edition) lighter and add more hp and torque? That's what would be needed for a Toyota built Supra to outperform the C8. Oh and still keep the base price under $60K.
 
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