[Ryeno]

Probably one of the most frequently asked questions is the difference between the 2JZ-GE and the 2JZ-GTE block to which the answer is oil squirters.

First it's important to understand where the oil squirters are.

Inside the block below the pistons.

Second it's important to understand how they work (in the 2JZ-GTE)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMnFbsy0Hgg

They squirt oil onto the piston. In the case of the 2JZ-GTE, the piston has a gallery inside that allows oil to flow through it reaching closer to the the piston crown.

Third it's important to understand why this is important.

Approximately 80% all of the excess heat created during combustion is absorbed by the piston. Almost all this heat is transferred through the piston rings. By allowing oil to flow near the crown it substantially lowers the temp. By how much? Depends on the boost you are running but this is a good estimation.

Fourth It's important NOT to confuse the squirters or the oil gallery with piston strength. They don't make the piston physically stronger in the sense that more boost can be pushed but engine stronger in the longer run, reliability in other words.

Fifth and finally only cast pistons can have the oil gallery inside, all forged pistons because of forging process don't support the oil gallery. Even so engines with forged pistons can still benefit from squirters by cooling the bottom of the piston. Although not as effective this is still better than nothing. REMEMBER THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND. BESIDES THE OIL SQUIRTERS THERE IS NOTHING TO COOL DOWN YOUR PISTONS DIRECTLY AND THEY ARE ONE OF THE HOTTEST PARTS IN YOUR ENGINE TOUCHING THE COMBUSTION GASSES DIRECTLY.

Last but not least the biggest myth is that having oil squirters sacrifices / damages the rest of your system. This is completely false. There is a quart of extra oil in your engine doing nothing and the engine doesn't run a "just enough to get by" oil pump. Remember oil squirters aren't an "upgrade" they are a factory spec part on the GTEs.

To wrap it up there are no cons to oil squirters only pros. I hope this thread helps other people learn and make a more educated in choice in deciding if they want to build up the NA block or not.

 

[twinturbosupra94]

 

[Kracin]

very well put together thread, except that the topic has been discussed and decided upon since before you could even drive.

 

[Slow_Supra]

great info, thanks!

 

[Kruso]

Last but not least the biggest myth is that having oil squirters sacrifices / damages the rest of your system. This is completely false. There is a quart of extra oil in your engine doing nothing and the engine doesn't run a "just enough to get by" oil pump. Remember oil squirters aren't an "upgrade" they are a factory spec part on the GTEs.

To wrap it up there are no cons to oil squirters only pros. I hope this thread helps other people learn and make a more educated in choice in deciding if they want to build up the NA block or not.

First off you're not qualified to make that call, don't fill this thread with opinions and present them as facts. If you're goin to refute this statement then I would like to see this in writing from a reputable entity that builds 2JZs. We know for a fact that blocking off oil squirters is beneficial for certain engines, Google Earl Lasky, he puts out more power per cylinder out of 4 banger then you do out of your entire straight six.

How in THE heck is a Frequently Asked Question?? For those of you that don't know this was a "Ryeno Asked Question" in this previous thread which he butchered up beyond all repair... all for an attempt to try and get a chance to publicly prove another member wrong:

Warning: Only click on it for a quick laugh, there's absolutely NO informative info present in either of these threads.

http://www.supraforums.com/forum/showthread.php?633713-stroked-Na-supra

Kruso

 

[twinturbosupra94]

Someone just delete this thread. Its not helping anyone or serving a purpose at all.

For a stock motor, oil squirters are helpful but as soon as you go above that they become useless and dangerous. This is because as the cylinder temperatures go up, splashing oil that is a large difference in temperature can/will cause dramatic change in cylinder temperature. This can/will cause catastrophic failure.

Also if you ARE moving above stock, you will need some sort of engine management. Usually you can log EGT and knock for control of cylinder temperature. Also at a certain point, you should be running forged pistons that don't need or require oil squirters.

 

[cyberBird]

:lol: i'm in disbelief, i go to bed after the "stroked na" thread and wake up to this? SF comedy at its finest.

 

[Ryeno]

For a stock motor, oil squirters are helpful but as soon as you go above that they become useless and dangerous. This is because as the cylinder temperatures go up, splashing oil that is a large difference in temperature can/will cause dramatic change in cylinder temperature. This can/will cause catastrophic failure.

Did you just say cooling your engine is dangerous? By that same logic running water/coolant/antifreeze is dangerous because it's a large difference from cylinder temperature.

We know for a fact that blocking off oil squirters is beneficial for certain engines, Google Earl Lasky, he puts out more power per cylinder out of 4 banger then you do out of your entire straight six.

GM to Ferrari, Porsche to BMW, NASCAR to F1, all run oil squirters in there HIGH performance engines. With millions in R&D spent doesn't that tell you something about the significance of oil squirters?

 

[Kruso]

GM to Ferrari, Porsche to BMW, NASCAR to F1, all run oil squirters in there HIGH performance engines. With millions in R&D spent doesn't that tell you something about the significance of oil squirters?

I know its difficult... but really atleast give it a try once in a while instead of selective reading/ copying/ pasting.

If you're goin to refute this statement then I would like to see this in writing from a reputable entity that builds 2JZs.

 

[Ryeno]

Kurso, You seem to think that you've proven squirters are bad and It's my job to refute your statements. It's the otherway around, all the data shows they are positive and it's your job to prove they are not (if you so wish to). Saying a few builders don't bother running squirters doesn't prove they aren't beneficial, It just proves some builders don't run them. So i'll ask you this, Kurso, do you have any scientific empirical data proving oil squirters are bad, dangerous or not useful?

 

[twinturbosupra94]

Did you just say cooling your engine is dangerous? By that same logic running water/coolant/antifreeze is dangerous because it's a large difference from cylinder temperature.



GM to Ferrari, Porsche to BMW, NASCAR to F1, all run oil squirters in there HIGH performance engines. With millions in R&D spent doesn't that tell you something about the significance of oil squirters?

Sigh I am so tired of you. You have no idea how engines work period. You are just a copy/paste without a single thought.

All the regular OEM manufacturers have them there for STOCK CARS. THEY DON'T DESIGN OIL SQUIRTERS FOR CARS THAT LEAVE THAT STOCK LEVEL. PERIOD. You leave stock level and start making more power, temperatures are obviously going to go up from the normal stock level which OEM manufactors didn't design the oil squirters for. NASCAR and F1 run them because they have BILLET ENGINE PARTS and are REVVING AT WELL OVER 10,000RPM.

Next did I say cooling? I said cylinder temperatures. Go pick up a material science book. Tell me what happens when you rapidly and unevenly drop the temperature of cast iron. This apply to engines ABOVE STOCK LEVEL TOO. NASCAR and INDY don't have to worry about failures because guess what they do after every race? THATS RIGHT GENUIS! They replace the engines! Oil squirters in that case allows them to maintain high RPM levels. That and with billet/titanium parts, they have little to worry about breakage wise. Only thing that can happen is warping but thats why the engine is tore down and rebuilt.

At the end of the day you are a moron and a toolbag. Oil squirters designed by OEM manufactors like GM, Porsche, etc. were designed around the engine at STOCK LEVELS. Anything above that and you can't apply that R&D anymore. You love interpolating data. NASCAR and INDY run them because they have billet engine parts. Do you have any idea how much a billet crankshaft costs? More than your whole entire SC300 and swap. If you CAN afford that, you definitely don't need to read a thread made by a 20 year old that hasn't rebuild a single engine in his/her life.

 

[Kruso]

Kurso, You seem to think that you've proven squirters are bad and It's my job to refute your statements. It's the otherway around, all the data shows they are positive and it's your job to prove they are not (if you so wish to). Saying a few builders don't bother running squirters doesn't prove they aren't beneficial, It just proves some builders don't run them. So i'll ask you this, Kurso, do you have any scientific empirical data proving oil squirters are bad, dangerous or not useful?

On the contrary, I'm not the one who posted a gibrish thread. Its your job to post factual data from actual reputable 2JZ builders, not absolute randomness stolen from different articles. What I wanna know is where you get the balls to post on Supraforums when you go around making statements like "toyota brand is an embarrassment" on other forums.

 

[Ryeno]

@ Kurso if you have personal issues you want to discuses with me take it up in the PMs, if want to debate oil squirters please start posting facts.

@ twinturbosupra94 the more boost you run and further past stock level you go the more important cooling is. You don't want the piston to end up like this.

The oil will actually turn to carbon on the piston itself.

 

[2jz_fanatic]

All I have to say, is wow can he be more of a complete idiot? Not you Kruso, Ryeno.....

Jordan.

 

[2jz_fanatic]

Ryeno, you do realize you just basically said what twinturbo94 was getting at right? He was trying to state that the oil squirter's are only designed for factory applications. Once you go BEYOND FACTORY the squirter's no longer provide the same cooling. Sooo in closing.... You just failed your own argument...


Jordan.

 

[Vicious]

Nay.

/thread

 

[Ryeno]

Ryeno, you do realize you just basically said what twinturbo94 was getting at right? He was trying to state that the oil squirter's are only designed for factory applications. Once you go BEYOND FACTORY the squirter's no longer provide the same cooling. Sooo in closing.... You just failed your own argument...


Jordan.

The further you go beyond factory spec the more important cooling is not less. That's why people get new radiators, front mount intercoolers, oil coolers, power steering coolers, trd thermostat basically do whatever they can to LOWER temps. The fact is from street cars like the Supra to even BMW M's to high performance race vehicles like NASCAR and F1, they all use oil squirters because they are the ONLY, let me repeat that, the ONLY thing that cools down the pistons directly.

 

[twinturbosupra94]

@ Kurso if you have personal issues you want to discuses with me take it up in the PMs, if want to debate oil squirters please start posting facts.

@ twinturbosupra94 the more boost you run and further past stock level you go the more important cooling is. You don't want the piston to end up like this.

See once again you are a fucking toolbag.

The oil will actually turn to carbon on the piston itself.

Read the actual comment. It says that that piston failed from LUBRICATION and is from a MOTORCYCLE. You are so god damn stupid.

You still don't comprehend that cooling cast iron rapidly and unevenly will cause it to catastrophically fail.

God you are a moron.

 

[2jz_fanatic]

The further you go beyond factory spec the more important cooling is not less. That's why people get new radiators, front mount intercoolers, oil coolers, power steering coolers, trd thermostat basically do whatever they can to LOWER temps. The fact is from street cars like the Supra to even BMW M's to high performance race vehicles like NASCAR and F1, they all use oil squirters because they are the ONLY, let me repeat that, the ONLY thing that cools down the pistons directly.

As this may be true, the fact is the more POWER you push the hotter your cylinder walls get, and the less effective your oil squirter's become.

Jordan.

 

[Ryeno]

You still don't comprehend that cooling cast iron rapidly and unevenly will cause it to catastrophically fail.

The pistons are heated unevenly to being with just like the cylinder head. exhaust side is hotter than the intake side. Also the stock pistons are hypereutectic which is aluminum + silicon, not iron.

As this may be true, the fact is the more POWER you push the hotter your cylinder walls get, and the less effective your oil squirter's become.

Jordan.

The oil squirters don't become less effective, the oil may get hotter because it's absorbing more heat from the cylinders but that's a GOOD THING and a proper oil cooler setup is designed to lower oil temps.