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Damn I can't believe that connector blew up like that....

Andi do you know any place I can find out about the different clubs in Florida? Like a web site or forum or something? NASA, PCA, SCCA and all sorts of different clubs rent out tracks for lapping days, trying to figure out the best one around here (Roebling Road, Moroso and Sebring are closest) I already know NOT to go to any more SCCA events....
 

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Grant said:
Damn I can't believe that connector blew up like that....

Andi do you know any place I can find out about the different clubs in Florida? Like a web site or forum or something? NASA, PCA, SCCA and all sorts of different clubs rent out tracks for lapping days, trying to figure out the best one around here (Roebling Road, Moroso and Sebring are closest) I already know NOT to go to any more SCCA events....
Try http://www.opentracking.com/

Also, Andi, what kind of coolant temperatures were you seeing on the gauge and how did that compare to what you saw on the stock gauge?
 

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Andi said:


The stock gauge stays dead center from 83C to 107C. At 110C it's at 2/3 and at 115C it's at 3/4. The highest I saw was 115C.

Andi
Hmm, that's not that bad. Between that and the news that a single seems to help with cooling, I'm beginning to wish I hadn't sold my FMIC. On my previous car, 2/3rds was 230F+, which is getting into head warping territory on cars with aluminum heads. Where are you measuring coolant temps?
 

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Eric said:


Hmm, that's not that bad. Between that and the news that a single seems to help with cooling, I'm beginning to wish I hadn't sold my FMIC. On my previous car, 2/3rds was 230F+, which is getting into head warping territory on cars with aluminum heads. Where are you measuring coolant temps?
Eric,

Do the math, it's the same on this car.. :rolleyes: 2/3 = 110C = 230F. 3/4 = 115C = 240F.

So I guess I should set the warning light on the Greddy gauge to 110C and let out when it lights up?

I had the Greddy temp probe installed in the metal pipe connecting the upper radiator hose to the head -- right next to the stock probes for the coolant gague and the ECU's coolant temp reading.

And yes, with an oil-cooled single, you won't have to worry about coolant temps. You may be right that even a water cooled single will be ok, but I'd rather not risk it. I have an oil cooler anyway, so I'll go with an oil-only cooled single. Coolant burns and boils before oil does...

Andi
 
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Andi - how'd you do on the track relative to the other fast cars out there? Just curious. BTW, I dialed in more front camber for the autox this weekend and it really helped the turn in and balance. I was only able to get -1.75 at the Eibach ride height. I would have hoped to get more negative. I maxed out the forward cam adjustment - any ideas?? Also maxed out at 3.5 caster on one side. Nice track pix - looks like you had fun. Regards, Jeff B.
 

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jkbrauch said:
Andi - how'd you do on the track relative to the other fast cars out there? Just curious. BTW, I dialed in more front camber for the autox this weekend and it really helped the turn in and balance. I was only able to get -1.75 at the Eibach ride height. I would have hoped to get more negative. I maxed out the forward cam adjustment - any ideas?? Also maxed out at 3.5 caster on one side. Nice track pix - looks like you had fun. Regards, Jeff B.
I was the fastest out there on street tires, and faster than most on race tires too. I was only passed by Jay Lopez in his "4RE ETR" Viper on Hoosiers; he was about a couple seconds faster (just a guess, he didn't have a transponder for timing, but I was hanging with him pretty good and I'm running 2 minutes flat.)

Andi
 

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Andi said:


Eric,

Do the math, it's the same on this car.. :rolleyes: 2/3 = 110C = 230F. 3/4 = 115C = 240F.


Oops. You're right. I was coming up with 220F for some reason. I feel like an Arts and Science major now.....:)


So I guess I should set the warning light on the Greddy gauge to 110C and let out when it lights up?


I'm not sure on a mkiv. They seem to be less prone to head warping than DSMs, which I have a lot of experience (mine and with other people's cars) with. I know somebody that ran their mkiv into the red section of the stock gauge on a racetrack after losing a belt, which is probably 250F+ without any warping. On a DSM, you'd be pulling the head and resurfacing it at those kind of temps. I personally wouldn't run it past 230F, but you might be ok going higher than that.


And yes, with an oil-cooled single, you won't have to worry about coolant temps. You may be right that even a water cooled single will be ok, but I'd rather not risk it. I have an oil cooler anyway, so I'll go with an oil-only cooled single. Coolant burns and boils before oil does...


I'm just making a SWAG on this one, but I have a hard time believing that the coolant that flows though that little turbo cooling hose is very significant to the cooling system as a whole. Also, as a corollary to your coolant boils before oil statement, keep in mind coolant cools things a lot better than oil does, so a water cooled turbo is likely to last longer.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Eric said:


Oops. You're right. I was coming up with 220F for some reason. I feel like an Arts and Science major now.....:)

[/b]

I'm not sure on a mkiv. They seem to be less prone to head warping than DSMs, which I have a lot of experience (mine and with other people's cars) with. I know somebody that ran their mkiv into the red section of the stock gauge on a racetrack after losing a belt, which is probably 250F+ without any warping. On a DSM, you'd be pulling the head and resurfacing it at those kind of temps. I personally wouldn't run it past 230F, but you might be ok going higher than that.

[/b]

I'm just making a SWAG on this one, but I have a hard time believing that the coolant that flows though that little turbo cooling hose is very significant to the cooling system as a whole. Also, as a corollary to your coolant boils before oil statement, keep in mind coolant cools things a lot better than oil does, so a water cooled turbo is likely to last longer. [/B]
Thanks for the advice.

And I agree, an oil cooled turbo will probably last less than a water cooled turbo. But I feel comfortable letting the turbo take more of the abuse if that means taking away some of the load off the cooling system. Turbos are $1000.. Motors are way more.

Andi
 

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Andi do you know if an oil cooler is necissary with a water-cooled turbo, or will the stock one be enough? I know you don't have an oil temp gauge, but have you talked to anyone about it?
 

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Grant said:
Andi do you know if an oil cooler is necissary with a water-cooled turbo, or will the stock one be enough? I know you don't have an oil temp gauge, but have you talked to anyone about it?
All the stock oil cooler does is transfer heat from the oil to the coolant. Personally I'd add a real oil cooler anyway, even though you probably wouldn't have to.

Andi
 

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Grant said:
Andi do you know if an oil cooler is necissary with a water-cooled turbo, or will the stock one be enough? I know you don't have an oil temp gauge, but have you talked to anyone about it?
From the oil temps Jeff Hood has posted, you need additional oil cooling beyond the stock cooler if you're spending time on a racetrack with a mkiv. I think he saw 290F WITH the Greddy cooler, so temps are almost certainly in excess of 300F without one.
 

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Ug WTF am I thinking, I'll just install an aquamist 2s and be done with it. If you go by its height and dept (the main factors that influence IC flow) the stock IC flows well enough anyways. Plus Reg had already told me the stocker keeps the temps well in line, since he runs ~15 psi (I think) and the turbo is much more effecient. Thanks for the help.
 

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hey guys I just wanted to make a comment on oil cooled versus oil/water cooled turbos. The main reason water cooled turbos were intoduced was to help cool the oil that runs through the turbo. This helps prevent the breakdown of the motor oil. It also significantly lowers required cool down times. There are no real reliability issues with an oil cooled turbo, as long as you maintain it a little differently. For example, allow more car cool down time after running, and change your oil much more often then you would a water cooled unit. If you want to get some good info on this I suggest you pick up "Maximum Boost" by Corky Bell.
 
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