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Moderator, l337 M0d3r4t0r
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys, I was just talking with local guys about our stock IC.... I still firmly believe it's not as bad as everyone things.. Obviously it's no Separco intercooler but I don't think it's hardly crap. I mean if you can get 100-250 RWHP increase on the same intercooler that’s incredible.

So what I'm doing is calling out all the dogs out there to show some PROOF that the stock IC really does have the 1 PSI drop for each 3 psi of boost. I also would like to see someone post the efficiency of the intercooler....


BTW the site that has the HKS figures I don't consider proof... Wouldn't you make you're intercoolers that you sell look much better especially if you sell one FOR the mk3 supra?

Some proof form someone that has nothing to loose from doing the tests.. IE Gus from the turbo dodge site.. (Yes hes been flamed for using a leaf blower) what does that represent? Well if intercooler a flow this much better then b at this CFM then we can calculate how much better a is then b..


So... Lets see some proof...

BTW as I said I don't think it's the BEST intercooler I think its a damn good intercooler for a stock intercooler... But there are obvious limits.
 

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1 ur Mom warned U about
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:scratch: :weed:

wrong section
 

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In The Sonoran Desert
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I am fairly certain the Reg Reimer did flow tests on the intercoolers. It was either him or Steve Jarvis. It showed that the stock unit was/ is very good. The Greddy SIDE-mount replacement sucks and the front-mounts are much better.

No one ever dissed the stock IC. it is very good and works up to BPU+++++ levels very well. Above that, it becomes a liability.

Let me try to find the website
 

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488ci V10 Power
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I dont know about flow testing, but it HAS been tested that a new FMIC has showed a 3-4mph increase in trap speeds with just BPU cars.

12.5 @ 117 with bpu
12.1 @ 121 with FMIC
 

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Premium Member
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There was a recent post the MkIV list with actual temp numbers and the stock SMIC is just fine.

...or is this supposed to be a MkIII question?
 

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Well IMO the MKIII intercooler is far superior to the stock MKIV intercooler with its plastic end tanks.

I know John in Asheville makes 440rwhp on his stocker MKIII.
 

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Last week I put a fast-response thermocouple in the intake (upstream of the intercooler) so I could get some temperature measurements. I found that as long as I was at or below about 10 PSI for relatively short periods intake temp was essentially the same as outside temp. I have an HKS intake with a home- fabricated airbox to try and keep the engine bay air away from the filter. The temperature outside was around 48 degrees. I got on the interstate and punched it in fourth gear and the temperature came up quickly. I kept on accelerating through almost the top of fifth and the intake temperature got up to 135 degrees (87 degrees above ambient). This was running 19 PSI on the stock twins, so they were running well out of their efficiency range. I think as a rule of thumb most intercoolers, if properly sized, are expected to keep intake temps at or under 40 degrees above ambient. I'd say it is easy to see how a BPU car could benefit from a front mount. I didn't get a chance to measure the temps right out of the turbos to get a delta across the intercooler, but I hope to sometime.
 

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I was reading in a mag that Jason at AEM has a built auto with SP 63 (I think that was the turbo) and makes around 700WHP and is still on the stock side mount :eek: , I think it was super street that It was in. They did some articles on Sleepers and he was one of the cars. Maybe he could chime in on this...
 

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My T61/.58 setup made 482 RWHP/458 RWTQ at about 20.5 psi with the stock MAF. Not too shabby for a stock IC I would say. The stocker is better than most or all of the aftermarket SMICs that I know of.
 

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Hello All

I have just completed a IC upgrade together with 2½” hardpipes. With the EXACT same setting on my boost controller, the boost went from 0,6 bar to 0,9 bar (that is a solid 4 Psi increase) without touching anything except for the installation of IC. I do believe that the gain at this level primarily comes from the 2½” hardpipes but at higher pressures I think the difference will be even higher.
I’m currently making a setup so I can compare the stock IC efficiency with the new IC setup I got. We will measure temperature drop as well as pressure drop with the IC’s mounted on a Supra operating under real conditions.
I will post the results as soon as completed.

Pictures of the new IC: http://www.supra4ever.dk/new_ic.htm


Later
Karsten
www.supra4ever.dk/index.htm
 

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25psi = 14" brakes :)
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I think if your on a budget, two stock MK3 ICs will work fine. The plumbing can get intense, but they will flow plenty of air. and should even cool it pretty good for most street driving.
If you wanted to, you could lay the lower one down flat, and build an air scoop to force air over the cooler. The rear cooler will not be as effective, but it will improve the flow.
I'm running a MAXX direct fit FMIC, it's about 3" thick, cross flow Garrett core and I think 13" high by 24" wide? I'm not sure about that, there are some pics on the MAXX website.
I don't have any flow v/s stock data however, the stock CT was replaced with a 60-1 trim, so it flows much more air anyway.
I've seen Gus's site, and his leaf blower was a good test. It was completly fair as far as I'm concerned, and it was nice to see the stock one do better than others you would figure should beat it.
 

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Moderator, l337 M0d3r4t0r
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Shiz.. I must have posted in the mk4 section?

My bad.. I ment to post in the mk3 section and I was talking about the STOCK mk3 intercooler


BTW John I know.. I'm trying to get all the haters out there to confront this a bit...


BTW it's Eric W and yes I did 445 on my stock IC.
 
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From Regs site:

>>>>>>>>>>

#1 Stock 93.5 Supra TT side mount Intercooler flows 251.0 CFM at, 20
inch's of H20 pressure
#2 Greddy TT side mount Intercooler kit flows 247.90 CFM at, 20 inch's
H20 pressure
#3 HKS 3 row 400mm x 265mm x 97mm flows 330.9 CFM at, 20 inch's H20
pressure
#4 Stock 1989 MA-71 Intercooler flows 169.0 CFM at, 20 inch's H20
pressure

>>>>>>>>>>>

We can crunch some numbers to figure out pressure drops at certain mass flow, but not sure where that is going to get us.

So what I'm doing is calling out all the dogs out there to show some PROOF that the stock IC really does have the 1 PSI drop for each 3 psi of boost. I also would like to see someone post the efficiency of the intercooler....
Pressure drop doesn't work like that since it isn't linear. Where did this come from?

I'll do some calculations, if nobody comes up with the "goods".

I'm too sleepy right now. :)
 
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I believe there's an mkiv here in colorado making over 500rwhp on the stock sidemount, i'll have to look more into it
 

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Canada, Eh?
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Shawndude said:
#4 Stock 1989 MA-71 Intercooler flows 169.0 CFM at, 20 inch's H20
pressure
Ouch! that looks like proof that using a stock MKIV IC could be a decent cheap upgrade....
 

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You can always overpower any bottleneck in the intake system with more boost. This goes for the IC, the pipeing, the throttlebody, the head.

The thing is, with a high-flow, high-efficiency IC, you can get more power with less boost. If you push the turbo less hard, you will produce less heat typically.

I know that in 9yrs, I have heard very few people who did not feel a gain from upgrading the MKIII IC.
 
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MrBoost said:
You can always overpower any bottleneck in the intake system with more boost. This goes for the IC, the pipeing, the throttlebody, the head.

The thing is, with a high-flow, high-efficiency IC, you can get more power with less boost. If you push the turbo less hard, you will produce less heat typically.
Fully agree.

You can make 700 hp on the stock intercooler if you want. The turbo would be working its heart out, but just about any restriction can be overcome with more boost.

It is the sum of all parts that matters. The idea is to invest money in upgrading components that are the most restrictive and work your way down.

The stock piping is the first thing that should be taken care of, as it is quite horrible.

/mr obvious :)
 

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This Is Why I'm Hot.....
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MrBoost said:
You can always overpower any bottleneck in the intake system with more boost. .....I know that in 9yrs, I have heard very few people who did not feel a gain from upgrading the MKIII IC.
Hello Jeff,
Thank you for stating the obvious, that is also a standard reminder item. Pump up the volume, & make more power. Hallelujah.

I am one of those guys who'd do an infomercial for the Spearco. The car ran so much better, not just more power.

Do we really need to know pressure drop when real flow data was already published? On that value alone, perf of the core is pitiful compared to any upgrade. Ho hum. Since Eric wants to know pressure drop so badly, I vote that Eric do the work- go for it, man! LOL.
;)
Take care.
 
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