[CheckElbow]

Insert roll eyes emoji here.. bud are you serious? Give it up.

That's exactly what I thought.

Don't get shriveled nuts and try to backpedal now.

Tomorrow I'll be sure to post my deposition and photographic exhibits, Marcia.

 

[s937717]

You're talking about self awareness when you can't even read and decipher that the topic in question was merely that more weight = more traction?

There was no other debate, you created one.

Then lost it.

Lmao.

I already summarily dismissed your previous claim that I don't own a Supra, seeing as how I don't owe you any kind of explanation since you are absolutely nobody - but since I seem to live rent free in your head, would me writing down "Patrick94TT is dickriding clown" on a piece of paper laying on the hood of my Supra be sufficient evidence for you, Sherlock?

brb

Nah, the topic was when you told someone to brush up on their physics because he said less weight would handle and corner better. I'm still waiting on your explanation there. The topic in question was never grip from a stand still. It was very specifically about about cornering.

More weight does not equal better handling; tires do not work that way. If the GTR was lighter it would handle better and corner harder. Sounds like he was making excuses, haha.

We're all still waiting for this picture of "Patrick is a dickhead".

 

[Noble713]

More weight does not equal better handling; tires do not work that way. If the GTR was lighter it would handle better and corner harder. Sounds like he was making excuses, haha.

I went digging around the internet and it seems the original videos aren't on YT anymore (they are like 10 years old). This thread on the NSX forum has URLS/links to all of the videos but they are all gone: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/128804-The-creator-of-GTR-explains-how-the-GTR-is-so-heavy

The vids were a goldmine of info, it's like 30+ minutes of just Mizuno-san with a whiteboard, with English subtitles.

The closest thing I can find is this Top Gear interview which kinda summarizes his key points:
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/top-gear-magazine/top-gear-chats-mizuno-san-mr-gt-r

 

[s937717]

I went digging around the internet and it seems the original videos aren't on YT anymore (they are like 10 years old). This thread on the NSX forum has URLS/links to all of the videos but they are all gone: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/128804-The-creator-of-GTR-explains-how-the-GTR-is-so-heavy

The vids were a goldmine of info, it's like 30+ minutes of just Mizuno-san with a whiteboard, with English subtitles.

The closest thing I can find is this Top Gear interview which kinda summarizes his key points:
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/top-gear-magazine/top-gear-chats-mizuno-san-mr-gt-r

I think a lot of what he says about weight is related to safety and usability.

When he said oversteer is foolish he wasn't joking lol. Without turning vdc off there's pretty much a hard limit to oversteer. http://instagr.am/p/BuK1F4ABkFY/ that's my car in R mode on snow tires. You can hammer away at it and the car won't slide past a specific angle. With vdc off it becomes a completely different car though. There's some extensive warnings that turning vdc off is unsafe lol.

 

[JOutterbridge]

Takumi, exactly what the new Supra lacks. Great article indeed.

 

[Elliot]

I went digging around the internet and it seems the original videos aren't on YT anymore (they are like 10 years old). This thread on the NSX forum has URLS/links to all of the videos but they are all gone: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/128804-The-creator-of-GTR-explains-how-the-GTR-is-so-heavy

The vids were a goldmine of info, it's like 30+ minutes of just Mizuno-san with a whiteboard, with English subtitles.

The closest thing I can find is this Top Gear interview which kinda summarizes his key points:
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/top-gear-magazine/top-gear-chats-mizuno-san-mr-gt-r

He is talking about making the car easier to drive for a wide consumer base. Downforce =/= weight. Downforce and weight affect the car in different ways. Him comparing the two is an oversimplification: "An F1 car weighs 560kg, more than 600kg with the driver. How much downforce does an F1 car generate? Currently, it is around 1,300kg. So what is the total weight? 1,860kg [about the same as a GT-R with the driver on board, coincidentally]. A GT1 racing car weighs between 1,200 and 1,300kg. Plus downforce of 600kg, the actual weight on the car is 1,800kg… you see, very easy!” ". If you follow this logic the GTR should be just as fast an an F1 car around a circuit if it was using identical tires.

Downforce is a force that acts on the tire on the z axis. But wait, weight does the same thing, right? Only while the car is stationary or moving in a straight line. As soon as you yaw the car you have to accelerate the weight in the direction that you're moving. Some of the weight is transferred to a vertical load on the tire and the rest is a horizontal load. This is why cars slide. The tire cannot handle the horizontal load from the weight. Downforce is so great because you get the vertical load on the tire that increases grip, but without having to carry extra weight around the corner that loads the tire horizontally.

 

[te72]

...Downforce is so great because you get the vertical load on the tire that increases grip, but without having to carry extra weight around the corner that loads the tire horizontally.

Ding ding ding, this guy gets it. Transitional handling is a key factor in autocross in particular, my Miata being over 1000 lbs lighter than my Supra is all the education I need to understand this principle. Supra has wider, stickier tires, far better brakes, a much stiffer chassis, and about 5x the power, yet... the Miata is every bit as quick around the cones.

Weight man... it matters. Particularly now, as we head into winter. A heavier car might get going ok, but the moment you turn that wheel on icy roads... turns out that whole "bodies in motion" idea about them wanting to stay in motion holds especially true. Ask all those "I gots 4wd, I can goez as fast as I want" folks how they ended up in the ditch.