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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Do you guys ever run into issues with custom manifolds where the head flange doesn't want to go over the exhaust studs? I've heard that a cut is needed in the middle of the flange for flex and mine has that but maybe the cut isn't large enough? or wide enough to allow each side of the runner to flex?

I removed the last 2 exhaust studs and the manifold went on fine. The exhaust gasket matches the holes perfectly.

I may try opening up the center divide a bit to see if it helps.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Early XS Power manifolds needed to have a couple holes enlarged to fit. You could try removing the studs and then placing the manifold on the head and then try to screw the studs back in.
Tried that. Removed that last 2 studs and the manifold goes on fine. I let the manifold sit on the end of the studs and tried screwing in the 2 I removed and they won't line up. I may try opening up the exhaust stud holes but the manifold was just coated and I'm trying to avoid breaking the coating if any way possible.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
No, it's not. Drilling the mounting holes larger will mis-align the exhaust ports...


HiPSI- stick the manifold in the oven and get it hot. You have a coating of some sort... so it may/may not help... maybe try to keep it in the oven longer and/or hotter.

Choritsu-shi
I figure the coating process would of already gotten it pretty hot, but I'm open to idea's that consist of not drilling or cutting anything.

I wish I had test fitted the manifold prior to sending it off. That's my mistake but it's my daily so it wasn't exactly feasible to tear it apart.

Should I just up the bit size one until it fits or try using a unibit?
 

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No, it's not. Drilling the mounting holes larger will mis-align the exhaust ports...
Choritsu-shi
Don't listen to this guy ^^^

Make sure all of the holes in the flange are wider than they need to be to fit over the studs. You have to leave room for thermal expansion or you risk shearing the studs. Especially if it is a stainless steel manifold.

Read about stainless steel on the second page of the first post (it's the second uploaded picture):
http://www.supraforums.com/forum/showthread.php?641554-Materials-and-Tech-Exhaust-Manifold-Design

Don't torque the manifold down all the way to spec and the first heat cycle itself should align the ports for you when the metal expands. When it cools, then you can torque it down the rest of the way to spec.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Don't listen to this guy ^^^

Make sure all of the holes in the flange are wider than they need to be to fit over the studs. You have to leave room for thermal expansion or you risk shearing the studs. Especially if it is a stainless steel manifold.
That's what is weird is that I was "told" this manifold was used prior with a 74mm turbo and everything fit fine. However when I went to install it this was a completely different story. A small crack was fixed in the #1 runner and the manifold was recoated, is it possible that it warped? It's really hard to say since I didn't test fit the manifold prior to sending it off so it very well may of been this way before. I haven't had the best luck with this purchase yet, hopefully it's a minor fix.

Otherwise the turbo fits awesome, the runners are designed so that the oil return line is a straight shot down without interfering with the runners, and the ebay 4" downpipe / midpipe I ordered for $300.00 looks like it's going to be a bolt on affair which is great.

BTW this is an NA-T project (SC300) but this section of SF gets more visability and traffic.
 

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It's possible that whoever sold you it was constantly blowing out exhaust manifold gaskets and found out it was warped, so he sold it to get a new one. It could be warped. You don't need to test fit to check for warpage. You should have taken a straight edge to it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Manifold Pix:




 

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I figure the coating process would of already gotten it pretty hot, but I'm open to idea's that consist of not drilling or cutting anything.

I wish I had test fitted the manifold prior to sending it off. That's my mistake but it's my daily so it wasn't exactly feasible to tear it apart.

Should I just up the bit size one until it fits or try using a unibit?
No... get it hot, then install it while it's still hot. If it's been repaired then yes it has slightly changed. Once again, get it hot, then try installing while it's hot... and yes, you'll need to wear leather gloves.




BadTdabone- go back and highlight this part...

"All stainless materials have a very high coefficient of thermal expansion; thus, the design, style and fit of a stainless manifold must account for this unusual property."





"You have to leave room for thermal expansion or you risk shearing the studs."

That refers to the design and building a manifold not installing one that's already made. :faint:

I occasionally weld stainless steel... and I know better than to try attempt making a stainless steel turbo manifold. You think it's that simple? You obviously don't have a clue...


Choritsu-shi
 

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BadTdabone- go back and highlight this part...

"All stainless materials have a very high coefficient of thermal expansion; thus, the design, style and fit of a stainless manifold must account for this unusual property."
I know, that is why you need the holes to be larger than the stud, duh!

"You have to leave room for thermal expansion or you risk shearing the studs."
That refers to the design and building a manifold not installing one that's already made. :faint:
It's both. It is about manifold design in general, even pre-existing ones. If a SS Manifold is already made and the holes in the flange are the same size as the bolt, then it is simply a matter of poor design by the manufacturer. They didn't account for the material properties.

I occasionally weld stainless steel... and I know better than to try attempt making a stainless steel turbo manifold. You think it's that simple? You obviously don't have a clue...
Choritsu-shi
WTF are you talking about? I didn't say anything about making a manifold. I never said it was simple. It is, however, very simple to drill stainless steel. He should drill the holes out larger. I have a Bachelors of Science with a pending masters and I must say sir, that YOU don't have a clue. :bigok:
 

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I know, that is why you need the holes to be larger than the stud, duh!


It's both. It is about manifold design in general, even pre-existing ones. If a SS Manifold is already made and the holes in the flange are the same size as the bolt, then it is simply a matter of poor design by the manufacturer. They didn't account for the material properties.


WTF are you talking about? I didn't say anything about making a manifold. I never said it was simple. It is, however, very simple to drill stainless steel. He should drill the holes out larger. I have a Bachelors of Science with a pending masters and I must say sir, that YOU don't have a clue. :bigok:
good greif...a smart ass with a degree. :faint:

Uhhh...the holes don't get smaller... Stainless doesn't expand like that. Again, making the mounting holes larger will mis-align the ports. This will only increase the chances of an exhaust leak.

After seeing the pics... that type of ceramic coating goes on pretty thick... that's likely the fitment issue.... but I would still heat up the manifold and try to make it fit. If it doesn't fit? Then there's no harm done... if it does fit? Then it's a good thing he didn't fuck up his manifold any more than it is.

So you didn't say anything about making a manifold? Then who posted this link? http://www.supraforums.com/forum/sho...anifold-Design

It doesn't take a bachelors degree of science to know you have never drilled stainless steel flanges before, have you? I can assure you, it's not very simple... that's why in this profession, if we need to, we generally use a die grinder with a carbide bit. ;)

Choritsu-shi
 

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As larry said. Its common.
 

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It doesn't take a bachelors degree of science to know you have never drilled stainless steel flanges before, have you?
Is that a question? I've worked with metal, wood, platics and composites and have had prior experience with materials engineering. You don't know me, you don't know my experience or knowledge. Don't assume you know shit about me.

that's why in this profession, if we need to, we generally use a die grinder with a carbide bit
What profession are you referring to?


Also, I prefer to use a drill and clamps when "drilling" out holes. A radial drill press would work just fine.
 

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You should have read my sticky more carefully. It states (from where your quote left off):

"....of a stainless manifold must account for this unusual property. For example, a stainless header flange drilled perfectly for an exhaust bolt pattern with .3125-inch-diameter bolt holes attached to a cylinder head with .3125-inch-diameter bolts will shear half the bolts on the first warm up cycle. Larger-than-normal bolt holes are therefore necessary."

I hate having to use smileys like these... I prefer happy smileys, but you have deemed it absolutely necessary. :wtcslap:

I think that is all I have left to say in this thread.
 

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Is that a question? I've worked with metal, wood, platics and composites and have has prior experience with materials engineering. You don't know me, you don't know my experience or knowledge. Don't assume you know shit about me.



What profession are you referring to?


Also, I prefer to use a drill and clamps when "drilling" out holes. A radial drill press would work just fine.
Yes… it’s a question… did I hurt your feelings? Your background experience isn't an acceptable answer.... I'll just take it as a "no". I've worked with flour, eggs, sugar and milk and have had prior experience with gas and electric ovens... that doesn't mean I can bake a cake.... now does it.

So you use just a drill and some clamps… that’s it? Yeah right...

…in order to attempt drilling hardened stainless steel flanges I need a good low speed drill press, constant flow of coolant, a high quality drill bit… which needs to be re-sharpened every 30 seconds…if it lasts. This is why the industry uses milling machines instead. How is it you are able to drill effortlessly while the entire industry struggles to drill stainless ... magic drill bits?

I removed the last 2 exhaust studs and the manifold went on fine. The exhaust gasket matches the holes perfectly.
Tried that. Removed that last 2 studs and the manifold goes on fine. I let the manifold sit on the end of the studs and tried screwing in the 2 I removed and they won't line up. I may try opening up the exhaust stud holes but the manifold was just coated and I'm trying to avoid breaking the coating if any way possible.
HiPSI's doesn't have a problem with hole sizes.... the studs fit the holes… he has a problem with hole locations...particularly the last two studs... and he said he doesn't want to damage the coating. So tell me smart ass... how are you going drill without damaging the coating?

Also, drilling the holes larger, maintains the same center … IF you’re going to do it… the hole needs to be offset to match the stud... therefore you'll need to grind it.

I don't recommend doing either.... for the 5th time heating the manifold and many other parts before installing is the only way to put it on without the need to modify. I assure you 250F-350F degrees isn’t considered extreme exhaust temperatures…. It’s more than enough to move the manifold and it’s not going to shear off the studs.

Choritsu-shi
 

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So you use just a drill and some clamps… that’s it? Yeah right...
…in order to attempt drilling hardened stainless steel flanges I need a good low speed drill press
Ummm..... Hmmmm..... It seems you can't read. Maybe I'll highlight it for you, so it's really really simple for you.

Also, I prefer to use a drill and clamps when "drilling" out holes. A radial drill press would work just fine.
.
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did I hurt your feelings? Your background experience isn't an acceptable answer....
There is no way you could hurt my feelings over a computer buddy, but maybe you're feeling a little intimidated? I don't need acceptance, especially from you. :)
 
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