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Discussion Starter #1
I just want to hear testimonials on WHY you decided to go 1jz
and what benefits do you think it has over the 7m

short or long explainations are great :D
 

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Discussion Starter #3
i did poke around and the most i came up with was it the ability to have braggins right to say ive got twin turbo.

it has slightly better torque curve and less head gasket problems.

and kinda rare starting to be common though.

id like to know if their are other reasons for the swap.

seems foolish to spend the money for the extra 50hp or so and loose a liter of displacement.
 

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MotoFool said:
i did poke around and the most i came up with was it the ability to have braggins right to say ive got twin turbo.

it has slightly better torque curve and less head gasket problems.

and kinda rare starting to be common though.

id like to know if their are other reasons for the swap.

seems foolish to spend the money for the extra 50hp or so and loose a liter of displacement.
Here's why I did it:

Generally newer tech...
Better bottom end reliability...
Headgasket strength...
Higher rev limit (lower piston speed) (for road course)...
Quicker spool of twin turbos...
Wider power band... (also for road racing)...
MAS airflow...
Coil on plug...
Ability to bolt up the 6-speed if I choose...
Option to use a 3.0L block also if I choose... (admitedly even more cost)

...and you only loose a half litre ;) Besides... if you're making more HP and more torque then why does it matter if you loose displacement? :)

It is an expensive option but not as bad as a lot of people think. You can recover a lot through the sale of all your 7M parts. I recovered almost $2000.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
kudos for the great answer

that is what i was looking for.

are you 100% satisifed with your choice of the 1jz?
 

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I'll let you know for sure when it's running? ;) Mine isn't out yet as I choose to rebuild the whole car in the process and do all my mods too. (and I've been slacking in a big way since Sept...) Getting close to completion. Should be on the roads by spring.

When I was researching this though I did talk to every 1J owner I could find at the time and collected opinions. The net opinion I got was absolute joy over the engine itself but the swap can (if something doesn't go smoothly) be a huge pain. That was pretty much what the specs of the motor told I could expect so I am more than confident when the car rolls out I am going to be thrilled.

So yes... at this point even with all the work involved... I am still 100% satisfied.
 

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The 1jz impresses me on a daily basis. It is head and shoulders above the 7m. That is my opinion so dont jump on me. I have driven two 1j cars and both have been great. The stock one with exhaust and intake did 300 rwhp which is a bit more then a 50 hp difference.
 

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I've always been curious about the 1ZJ swap myself. I've often wondered why I would swap in a motor that honestly would have less power than I have now. The question I consider often is this:

Many of the shortcomings of the 7M can be overcome... A fully built 7M short block is plenty strong enough to handle 700 hp or more. The headgasket issue becomes a non-issue if you delete the EGR system including the EGR cooler, and run a good MHG like a HKS gasket. The Ignition system can be adapted to run MKIV coil packs without ignition wires. I plan to show people how to do this in another post on the SF. The intake manifold honestly isn't a bad setup, but it too can upgraded to a MKIV style intake.

I've personally worked around most of what Supra owners consider a weakness in the 7M. I am not putting the 1JZ guys down in the least... I completely applaud you guys who have completed the swap, as I am in many ways envious. I see the 1JZ swap as achieving the mistique of owning a JZA70, but not as a replacement for the power potential of the 7M.

One other thing that sort of swayed me away from the 1JZ. The money that I otherwise could have spent on a swap, I dropped into my 7M and have a motor that has output beyond what the stock twins of the 1JZ could do. But then again, my car only has 54,041 ORIGINAL miles on it :)

I guess my question is this... You'd spend realistically $4000 to complete a 1JZ swap in to a MKIII. Then you'd probably spend at least $3500-5000 to get power figures from that motor near 500hp. That's sitting optimistically on $9000. Consider how much you could do with a 7M for that.....

I'd honestly be a little sick if I spent $4000 to do a 1JZ swap in my Supra and drove away with a car that only runs low 14's - high 13's.

I'm not bashing 1JZ's as I've really considered it myself. Just hard to justify the cost.

- Hams
 

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The 1jz is a superior engine in every single aspect, from the oil cap to the drain plug. It is not an opinion, the two engines are not really even comparable build wise. When you spend 4,000 to swap in a 1jzgte, you also get a new(er) transmission, a map sensor based fuel control, a complete rear end assembly(if you buy from jarco), all the suspension parts(jarco again) low milage a-arms and front suspension parts(from clip) 89+front end converesion, and all other misc. parts from a clip-aka front half of car-add these to the build up of a 7m when comparing prices. Or better yet subtract them from the 1jz when you sell of all the stock pieces from the car. I made money going with a stock 1jz after selling the 7m,all the 7m upgrades I had, all the misc clip pieces. Came out to be about +$5.00. The engines do not react the same, a 400 hp 1jz does not feel like a 400 hp 7m. When comparing don't forget the map based airflow, ind. coil pack ignition, crank angle sensor/cam angle sensor based timing,front mounted TB, stock metal gaskets(all of them can be reused but the HG) an oil system not driven by a shaft, but directly, with real oil pressure. Factor those in. The displacement makes 0 difference. Mine makes 497 rwhp, 470 ftlbs tq. It cracks me up to hear people owning a 3 liter engine arguing about the benifits of displacement, but will easily take the "technologly is the replacement for displacement" stand when comparing them to domestics. My engine has 60,000ish miles on it, head has never been off, has 150.00 550cc injectors(used mkiv) and a used turbo that is based off a t-25 and makes almost 500rwhp and enough torque to break 285 series tires on 10 inch rims loose in a rolling 3rd gear punch. A mk3 with a 1jz is the best bang for the buck import car availible.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
toypro said:
The 1jz is a superior engine in every single aspect, from the oil cap to the drain plug. It is not an opinion, the two engines are not really even comparable build wise. When you spend 4,000 to swap in a 1jzgte, you also get a new(er) transmission, a map sensor based fuel control, a complete rear end assembly(if you buy from jarco), all the suspension parts(jarco again) low milage a-arms and front suspension parts(from clip) 89+front end converesion, and all other misc. parts from a clip-aka front half of car-add these to the build up of a 7m when comparing prices. Or better yet subtract them from the 1jz when you sell of all the stock pieces from the car. I made money going with a stock 1jz after selling the 7m,all the 7m upgrades I had, all the misc clip pieces. Came out to be about +$5.00. The engines do not react the same, a 400 hp 1jz does not feel like a 400 hp 7m. When comparing don't forget the map based airflow, ind. coil pack ignition, crank angle sensor/cam angle sensor based timing,front mounted TB, stock metal gaskets(all of them can be reused but the HG) an oil system not driven by a shaft, but directly, with real oil pressure. Factor those in. The displacement makes 0 difference. Mine makes 497 rwhp, 470 ftlbs tq. It cracks me up to hear people owning a 3 liter engine arguing about the benifits of displacement, but will easily take the "technologly is the replacement for displacement" stand when comparing them to domestics. My engine has 60,000ish miles on it, head has never been off, has 150.00 550cc injectors(used mkiv) and a used turbo that is based off a t-25 and makes almost 500rwhp and enough torque to break 285 series tires on 10 inch rims loose in a rolling 3rd gear punch. A mk3 with a 1jz is the best bang for the buck import car availible.
a mitsibishi t-25? i hope not that turbo can barely pass 300hp ona dsm





anyways this is the type of debate i was looking for
 

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toypro said:
The 1jz is a superior engine in every single aspect, from the oil cap to the drain plug. It is not an opinion, the two engines are not really even comparable build wise. When you spend 4,000 to swap in a 1jzgte, you also get a new(er) transmission, a map sensor based fuel control, a complete rear end assembly(if you buy from jarco), all the suspension parts(jarco again) low milage a-arms and front suspension parts(from clip) 89+front end converesion, and all other misc. parts from a clip-aka front half of car-add these to the build up of a 7m when comparing prices. Or better yet subtract them from the 1jz when you sell of all the stock pieces from the car. I made money going with a stock 1jz after selling the 7m,all the 7m upgrades I had, all the misc clip pieces. Came out to be about +$5.00. The engines do not react the same, a 400 hp 1jz does not feel like a 400 hp 7m. When comparing don't forget the map based airflow, ind. coil pack ignition, crank angle sensor/cam angle sensor based timing,front mounted TB, stock metal gaskets(all of them can be reused but the HG) an oil system not driven by a shaft, but directly, with real oil pressure. Factor those in. The displacement makes 0 difference. Mine makes 497 rwhp, 470 ftlbs tq. It cracks me up to hear people owning a 3 liter engine arguing about the benifits of displacement, but will easily take the "technologly is the replacement for displacement" stand when comparing them to domestics. My engine has 60,000ish miles on it, head has never been off, has 150.00 550cc injectors(used mkiv) and a used turbo that is based off a t-25 and makes almost 500rwhp and enough torque to break 285 series tires on 10 inch rims loose in a rolling 3rd gear punch. A mk3 with a 1jz is the best bang for the buck import car availible.
You have made all valid points there and I appreciate your insight. Again I would like to state that I am not bashing the 1JZ at all. In many regards I think it's an amazing complement for the MKIII chassis. I would like to offer that some of the things you've mentioned I do not consider a factor. The suspension pieces are of little difference to me since I've upgraded to the poly bushings offered by Jeff at SupraSport. The rear end is also something that I would not consider of significant advantage over the 7M. Everything else you'd said is quite true however. I think if I had to some up your comments, it would be this: The 1JZ simply is a superior platform from which to build the MKIII. For this I would probably agree. In fact, if I were not invested so deeply into my car, I would strongly consider the 1JZ route still. Part of the issue for me though is the extreme low mileage of my car and motor. The honest truth is that for me to swap to a 1JZ would result in dropping a motor with higher mileage than my 7M. I realize obviously this wouldn't be the case for most owners.

Anyhow, your point is quite valid regarding the 1JZ. One thing to consider... The 7M can be converted to a MAP based fuel system and the ignition system can be upgraded to run direct ignition via coilpacks from the MKIV ignition. Both of the modifications can be made for well under the price of a 1JZ swap.

Again, I applaud your swap, it's really beautifully done. I am quite envious of your car!

- Hams.
 

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I think its just a matter of personal preference, in accordance to your driving style. The 7m is a good street motor, while the 1jz is a track engine made for road racing. I too am considering the 1jz route, due to its more linear power curve. However, being 17 and in college, its very difficult for me to accumulate money for such a project. So therefore I've decided to mod my 7m up to the point I am satisfied with the power it makes. Then buy a 1jz clip and see how that goes.

So in short, I wouldn't care what engine sits inside, as long as it blows (the turbo that is), I'm satisfied....:D
 

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id like to go 1jz at some point, but being a broke college student makes it difficult. once i finish my downpipe and MKIV-style intake manifold with side-side FMIC, i hope ill be happy with the car...

what toypro said has always been in the back of my mind. going 1jz, you can actually greatly reduce the cost by selling extra parts... definetly something to seriously consider in my cars future.
 

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toypro said:
It cracks me up to hear people owning a 3 liter engine arguing about the benifits of displacement, but will easily take the "technologly is the replacement for displacement" stand when comparing them to domestics.
Ha!.... never thought of that.
 

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The displacement of the 1JZ has never been a factor for me. Heck, the RB26DETT is a 2.6 liter motor that's 1000hp capable. The 1JZ is definitely up to the task as well.

- Chris
 
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We have to remember that as the years go by, these cars only get older. And honestly, the 7M motor is a dinosaur compared to the 1J and 2J. I love the 7m all they way for its durability and the barriers it has broken, but good advice to anyone that is starting there supra career, buy a non turbo for a good price, and go for a swap. If on a budget, its a lengthy process, but well worth it. Who ever owns a 7M knows very damn well all the problems assocated with these cars, mostly due from age. starting with the head gasket down to the oil pump. I love my 7M and im going to ride with it for a while, but for sure a swap is in the future.
 

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Well Hams I have completed my swap and if my 1jz doesnt put down 500hp for under $4000 I will be very surprised. I love it when people throw around dollar amounts, they really don't mean much of anything. As far as I know it is not the EGR that causes BHG, at least in my opinion. I have seen a couple set ups, for the coil on plug, using the LS1 coil packs which from what i understand are cheaper then trying to use MkIV, but hell i just throw money around on 1jz swaps...LOL. It is all in fun Hams but I have become fed up with the 7m long ago, and refuse to sink any money into another one. Why spend money to convert to coil on plug, why spend the money to convert to a MkIV style intake, why spend the money to convert to MAP based operation?? It all comes stock on the 1jz. And toypro is right i got paid good money for my 7m when i did the conversion and i was glad to see her go.
 

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MightyAl said:
Well Hams I have completed my swap and if my 1jz doesnt put down 500hp for under $4000 I will be very surprised. I love it when people throw around dollar amounts, they really don't mean much of anything. As far as I know it is not the EGR that causes BHG, at least in my opinion. I have seen a couple set ups, for the coil on plug, using the LS1 coil packs which from what i understand are cheaper then trying to use MkIV, but hell i just throw money around on 1jz swaps...LOL. It is all in fun Hams but I have become fed up with the 7m long ago, and refuse to sink any money into another one. Why spend money to convert to coil on plug, why spend the money to convert to a MkIV style intake, why spend the money to convert to MAP based operation?? It all comes stock on the 1jz. And toypro is right i got paid good money for my 7m when i did the conversion and i was glad to see her go.
I'm glad to see your opinion bro. I think in the end it comes down to choice. I think both choices are good ones, it comes down to following your heart. For my car, it's an 87 hardtop two-tone brown car, and it has 54,000 miles on it original. I think for the sake of the rarity of my car, it would be a bad choice to swap to the 1JZ, and I hope you'd agree. I have stated in an earlier post that I think the 1JZ is a superior platform to build a MKIII on. Heck, I might do that on my 88 that I have, you never know.

I would like to mention this bud. For all of those who trash around the 7M and even the MKIII.... The motor has it's shortcomings sure, but consider the whole picture. Consider that most of these cars are perhaps 15 years old and they have the ability to put down 12 second passes with mere bolt-ons. I would like to offer up that I don't see Z31 300zx's of the same vintage coming near that on bolt-ons. I would also like to say that I feel that given the age of these motors, they are engineering marvels. The 7M can take a lot of punishment and I've honestly been amazed at how well it holds up. Maybe I'm just a rare case with my low mileage car, but I love the car for what it can do, given that it's a 87 model. I think that some people ought to step back and just thank Toyota for building a quality product that stands up over time. I know I do. I know I would love the 1JZ because it's a quality built product offered by Toyota, and I love my Supra for everything it is.

Merry Christmas guys.

Enjoy your Supra no matter what motor it has, because there's no other car like it.

- Hams
 
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